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  • Paul Chek thinks that low bodyfat on a women is about as dangerous as it can get, hormonal wise, way moreso then men. A womens sole purpose in life (biologically) is to have children, when that is not possible the body goes into complete meltdown mode. If there is no way to have a baby, there is no reason to live. Men can get away with so much more because of this.

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    • part of the pooch is muscle shape, part of it is fat carried over that space. I have one -- it was "bigger" or puffier when I ate wheat. Now that I don't, it's much smaller.

      But it looks great, imo.

      ---


      Also, I need a definition for proportionate/disproportionate.

      hour glass is proportional, so. . .?

      Comment


      • Originally posted by serenity View Post
        An hourglass shape is desirable for a woman, isn't it? I would guess that you're at 20% at most (which is actually desirable for a woman). There is a body fat percentage thread somewhere around here, and they linked to ths: Body Fat Percentage Pictures of Men & Women - BuiltLean

        You can look at the pics and compare. I think you're around 20% based on the pics. I thought I was maybe closer to 30% when I looked at the pics, but I got a bod pod measurement and was only 25.9%. But my fat distribution makes me look at lot fatter in the middle than the 25% pic. I'd guess that Malachi is probably around 15%? I think I read somewhere that women need at least 14% body fat to menstruate so by the time you get to 15% you're cutting it pretty close. (I'm assuming that it's unhealthy to be at a BF% that prevents menstruation, even if you don't plan on getting pregnant, just b/c it's probably an unnatural state to be in).

        And look at the pic of the man with 3-4% BF. Doesn't that look scary? I mean, you can see his blood vessels--ew!!!

        Edited to add: I tried your primal oatmeal, and it was good! I found some frozen strawberries in the freezer; they were old but still edible. I added cinnamon and cloves. Yum! It even looked like oatmeal.
        Thanks for that link! It was helpful. I guess I'm at 25% bf now, but the woman in the pic still looks good, so that's a relief

        Yeah, 20% was my guess for that pic. I got checked when I was back in London after a few weeks being primal and I was 19%. Then I cut some more, prob dropped to 18% and then all hell broke loose....

        20% is probably right for me.

        Great you liked the Primmeal! It's perfect on mornings when you want something hot and nourishing. Plus you can add any ingredients you like to it. Have you tried the primal pancakes yet? I prefer them to regular pancakes now. And so does my family! So they must be good
        "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

        In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

        - Ray Peat

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Cierra
          Hmm. Asking how much you should lift and how many reps you should do, is like asking how long a piece of string is! Hah, it's all relative. I'm not sure of your strength abilities, but the general rule is lower weights + more reps for a toned butt, or higher weights + less reps for muscle mass. Here is my personal routine, for just glute/thigh/upper leg exercises:
          Pull Day: Leg Curls: 65lbs x 10; 75lbs x 8
          Adduction: 145lbs x 10; 165lbs x 8
          Push Day: Glute Machine: 60lbs x 10 (per side); 70lbs x 8 (per side)
          Leg Extension: 70lbs x 10; 85lbs x 8
          Abduction: 130lbs x 10; 145lbs x 8
          Seated Leg Press: 150lbs x 10; 170lbs x 8

          I also try to make sure to run at least twice a week. The weights I listed for my personal training session may be too light for you, or may be too heavy for you. You're taller than me, and I'm not sure of your abilities. The glutes are a large muscle group, so heavier weights can be used without too much risk of injury. You can try starting at 30-50% of your body weight for smaller weights (toning with more reps) or 50-75% of your weight as a realllly rough guide. If you feel like you can do more, then up the weights! If you feel like you're killing yourself, lower the weights.

          Sorry I don't have a concise answer! You could always visit a personal trainer! I'm sure s/he'd know much more than I do. Sometimes you can even get a free training session your gym if you ask around.
          Thanks for all that info Lovely. Once I'm back in London I'll be hitting the gym again - will let you know how I get on! <3
          "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

          In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

          - Ray Peat

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Zach View Post
            Paul Chek thinks that low bodyfat on a women is about as dangerous as it can get, hormonal wise, way moreso then men. A womens sole purpose in life (biologically) is to have children, when that is not possible the body goes into complete meltdown mode. If there is no way to have a baby, there is no reason to live. Men can get away with so much more because of this.
            I know that's biologically probably true and not meant to be funny but - LOL!

            Maybe that's why I get depressed - I am the least broody person I know.
            "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

            In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

            - Ray Peat

            Comment


            • Originally posted by zoebird View Post
              part of the pooch is muscle shape, part of it is fat carried over that space. I have one -- it was "bigger" or puffier when I ate wheat. Now that I don't, it's much smaller.

              But it looks great, imo.

              ---


              Also, I need a definition for proportionate/disproportionate.

              hour glass is proportional, so. . .?
              We-ell, people tell me I'm hour glass, but I see myself as pear shaped, which is disproportionate. I have a pretty small bust compared to my hips. I've spent most of my twenties fighting those hips...
              "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

              In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

              - Ray Peat

              Comment


              • FTF
                Entry Twelve: There will be blood


                From yesterday... Was travelling to Poland. While here I'm going to get a full blood and hormone panel done. It's super cheap here!

                Sleep:
                1.30am - 6am: 4.5 hours. Woken again by my drunken housemate...

                Slept for an hour on the bus to airport, slept for two hours on plane.

                Stress:
                Woke up feeling extremely stressed. I was travelling to Poland yesterday, and am always anxious before flying. Mid morning I felt so stressed I had that "crying feeling". And I was pretty stressed for most of the day, til I caught my flight... which I nearly missed!

                But I had an interesting moment after sprinting to the gate. Normally when I've been totally stressed out I feel terrible when the stressful moment is over. Yesterday when I made it to the plane, I felt victorious! I presume this is the positive aspect of adrenaline?

                Food / Hunger / Cravings:
                Was starving. But, my hunger was largely driven by stress: I could recognise that today. And I could see that I'm still a way from resolving issues with food. Part of my stress today was worrying if I'd have enough time to get sushi at the airport. I did, and I nearly missed my flight as a result! Stress breeds stress.

                6am - Breakfast: banana, 3 x fried eggs, 2 x coffees w/ lf milk, tea w/ lf milk and sugar,
                11.00am - square of fudge, 550gs mango, can coconut water (330mls)
                12.30pm - Lunch: cup bone broth
                4.00pm - Dinner: sushi - 4 x california rolls, 1 x hand roll w/ salmon and avo
                9.30pm - tea w/ lf milk and sugar, 1x tomato, 1 x banana

                Cravings: Junk food. Clearly linked to stress! Was happy that I was satiated by the little piece of fudge.

                Fitness:
                1 hour yoga, running for plane

                Energy and mood:
                Stressed, emotional, and tired. Totally conked out on bus and plane.

                Supps:
                None today. I'm aware that I very much go in cycle of taking sups: I just listen to my body. Will be interested to see when I feel the need to take them again, and how long it will be for.

                Body:
                Water retention: Bloat =
                Sinus - Fine.
                Skin - Better.
                Rosacea: Got really hot after my stress to the plane.
                Lips - Good today!
                Keratosis pilaris: Better
                Digestion - Good.
                Temperature: Didn't take it...

                Final thoughts:
                Getting the following tests tomorrow:
                Liver function
                Full mineral panel
                Haemoglobin, ferretin etc.
                Thyroid: TSH, T3, T4
                Other hormones: Serotonin, Testosterone, Progesterone, Prolactin, Estrogen, Cortisol. Asked for Leptin but they don't have it.
                Cholesterol

                Altogether it will come to €100. And the doctors here are really good! Gotta love Poland.
                "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                - Ray Peat

                Comment


                • Hey you, yeah you, you're thinking too much.

                  "Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind."

                  You're trying to compartmentalize every detail of everything you experience, when it's all just various steps, actions, build ups, and causes and effects that lead to what you're feeling at that exact moment in time. Woke up feeling stressed -> poor sleep quality -> stress from poor sleep -> stress over all details that follow -> over thinking every feeling you're going through -> continuous stress throughout the day because it's the only thing you're thinking about.

                  What lead up to the poor sleep? Probably more of the same pattern. You're right in that stress breeds more stress. You can attempt to correct the various causes of stress in your body with diet, like frustration, anxiety, depression, etc; Serotonin probably. There are so many causes of stress though that's it's futile to attempt to address them in a stressful state, because that in itself is stress. Letting go is a great relief. It's only impossible if you think it is.

                  I'm of the opinion that mind > matter. Think back to certain people. Mark Sisson's diet blows, but he has a very expensive beach house paid for by his supplements, how unhealthy could he be when he doesn't have a concern in the world?
                  Make America Great Again

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                  • I think you have a cute little body and you certainly don't have a big bum or hips imo. I'm a bit larger in that department than you are and trying to building it out even more with muscle. The disturbing phrase "ass like a 10 year old boy" seems to have become popular in the media to describe some ideal female behind, but women are curvy with hips and fullness and I don't want anything to do with a man who is attracted to an ass that looks like a little boy! It doesn't mean it has to be fat but please don't look at the distance between your hipbones and think your hips are too big because you are built like a female. I think you have very average hips that keep you looking feminine and are just right. I would never in a million years describe your bum as generous either. It is very tiny! Nothing wrong with a big round bottom as long as it is round with muscle and not just sagging down with fat. I just don't think you have a thing to worry about. Anything in the tummy that you don't like will probably go away with improving your hormones, adding muscle will get you closer to you inspiration photo and in general you have a cute little body that anyone would be proud to live in.

                    Zach,
                    Kino is a perfect specimen but I agree with YB that height is a huge factor here. For us taller ladies it would take a massive amount of muscle to have the same proportions and it still wouldn't look the same. I have long ago given up on looking like women who are very different in height than myself.
                    PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
                    http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

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                    • What's wrong with liking smaller asses? It's still attached to a feminine curvature, so it's not like it looks like a 10 year old boy. The physical attribute I'm attracted most to, is that leg gap between the thighs. Sure, it's a fad that stemmed from an obsession with runway models, but I've always found it insanely attractive. I like really thin women, that most full bodied women claim to be "figureless prepubescent boys", which is sort of disrespectful and reeks of insecurity imo. Not saying anyone here is like that, just jotting down an observation.
                      Make America Great Again

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                      • Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
                        What's wrong with liking smaller asses? It's still attached to a feminine curvature, so it's not like it looks like a 10 year old boy. The physical attribute I'm attracted most to, is that leg gap between the thighs. Sure, it's a fad that stemmed from an obsession with runway models, but I've always found it insanely attractive. I like really thin women, that most full bodied women claim to be "figureless prepubescent boys", which is sort of disrespectful and reeks of insecurity imo. Not saying anyone here is like that, just jotting down an observation.
                        Just to be clear, I was NOT describing these things as being what I saw in YB! I was commenting on her own words describing herself. There is nothing wrong with little asses. When I see that comment about 10 year old boys being placed on women it is usually a small tight little bottom (which is fine) attached to a woman completely lacking in hips. Just straight, from armpit to knee. This bothers me because it brings women to look at someone like that and think that hips are wrong and unattractive. I've seen waif models that are skin and bone and still have hips that stick out past their waist, as they should, so this has nothing to do with fatness or thinness. I'm only wanting YB to see that on a skeletal level our bodies have hips that stick out. That is normal, attractive and just the way it is.

                        My comment about not wanting anything to do with a man who like that is not about liking small asses but rather liking a woman that reminds them of a 10 year old boy. That is just wrong.
                        PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
                        http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

                        Comment


                        • Okay, here is a decent example. She is thin, possible thigh gap if we could see it but lots of muscle makes for a full, round ass that is big in a good way and not the full figured way, which is not what I was trying to endorse. I'm just trying to be clear that I'm not trying to become a full figured girl just wanting the muscle to keep me round

                          http://media-cache-ec2.pinimg.com/73...5207067130.jpg
                          PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
                          http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
                            Just to be clear, I was NOT describing these things as being what I saw in YB! I was commenting on her own words describing herself. There is nothing wrong with little asses. When I see that comment about 10 year old boys being placed on women it is usually a small tight little bottom (which is fine) attached to a woman completely lacking in hips. Just straight, from armpit to knee. This bothers me because it brings women to look at someone like that and think that hips are wrong and unattractive. I've seen waif models that are skin and bone and still have hips that stick out past their waist, as they should, so this has nothing to do with fatness or thinness. I'm only wanting YB to see that on a skeletal level our bodies have hips that stick out. That is normal, attractive and just the way it is.

                            My comment about not wanting anything to do with a man who like that is not about liking small asses but rather liking a woman that reminds them of a 10 year old boy. That is just wrong.
                            For sure, I love hips.
                            Make America Great Again

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                            • Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
                              The physical attribute I'm attracted most to, is that leg gap between the thighs.
                              Really? Of all the things you could be attracted to in a woman, you're attracted to the thigh gap? How strange. (Not saying that there's anything wrong with it, just odd, that's all.)

                              I think having a thigh gap is partly being really thin and partly having the right bone structure. You also can't be too muscular.

                              I actually find it to be really ugly. It's especially noticeable when women with really thin legs wear really tight jeans, and then the gap is really obvious. It looks odd somehow. I don't know--it's all subjective.

                              I think the nicest thing on a woman are nice full breasts. (I will actually look at women's breasts, like kinda stare for a second, the way men do, even though I'm mostly straight.) I myself have small breasts, which is very unfortunate (and unfair since my mom has large breasts and of all the things I inherited from her, the breasts were not one of them), and if I ever got plastic surgery, it would be a boob job.

                              Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
                              Okay, here is a decent example. She is thin, possible thigh gap if we could see it but lots of muscle makes for a full, round ass that is big in a good way and not the full figured way, which is not what I was trying to endorse. I'm just trying to be clear that I'm not trying to become a full figured girl just wanting the muscle to keep me round

                              http://media-cache-ec2.pinimg.com/73...5207067130.jpg
                              That's a picture of a nice ass.
                              Last edited by diene; 05-08-2013, 04:14 PM. Reason: typo: breats-->breasts

                              My journal

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                              • Really thin women in tight jeans? Yes please. I don't know, I find it insanely attractive, even if most men don't even notice it(seems to be a female aspiration more than anything, ie; "thinspiration") I notice small things I find beautiful about the female body, that goes beyond the normal "tits and ass" fascination. It's like an admiration, the female body really is infinitely attractive. Soft, delicate, artistic, and I even notice how they're much more sensitive to touch than men. You can see that in how they react to finger tips running over most areas of their body. Of course, I've never touched a man like that, but for myself, I know I'm far less sensitive to touch.

                                Odd? You bet. I never have been anything but though.



                                ♥♥
                                Last edited by Derpamix; 05-08-2013, 04:52 PM.
                                Make America Great Again

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