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  • #31
    A couple things.

    Most thermometers are crap. Instead of the temp, keep track and look for trends. Make sure to do same place and time.

    Your ravenous hunger is exactly like what happened to the men who underwent the Minnesota starvation experiment. Even months after it was over, most of them could never get enough to eat no matter how much they stuffed themselves. Your body does crazy things under stress.

    Im amazed at the amount of food you consistently put down, bravo! You are truly doing your body good.

    Check out #whatwouldBillysay? - Blog hes got some really interesting ideas on how much people should really be eating.

    Have you tried a spoon of sugar and salt under your tongue when you cant sleep? It worked wonders for me when i was still struggling.

    Lastly, i know it is easier said then done byt try not to fight your body so much. Calling yourself fat and whatnot, your body loves you and is just trying to do what it thinks is best. Most women wage war on their bodies trying to force them to be slim by sheer will, your body will always win in the long run so best bet is to give it exactly what it needs and hope it thanks you by doing what it should. Also you are your body so this paragraph sounds funny but you get what im saying.

    Comment


    • #32
      Hey Knife, btw - I remember reading a post of yours before where you said that when you started Primal you ate solidly for several months... Am I remembering right? Why do you think you did that?
      Not sure what you mean by "solidly". As for nutrient dense, yes. I had no idea I was so deprived of basic vitamins. I was eating a LOT of liver for - I forget now - weeks, or months. And it was an angelic moment the day I realized I didn't want any, I'd saturated my body with B vitamins and more, and my constant urge to eat, eat, eat was suddenly held at bay. My whole body feels heavier now, I am solid, my bones take more work to move through space and my muscles have grown to move them. It's a whole new body!
      Last edited by Knifegill; 03-23-2013, 09:53 PM.
      Crohn's, doing SCD

      Comment


      • #33
        Hey, I just wanted to say that I l-l-love yoou

        Make America Great Again

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
          Hey, I just wanted to say that I l-l-love yoou

          Awwwwwwww! You're the sweetest Derp.

          Btw, your sig
          pull my still beating heart from my chest
          totally reminds me of this Simpons scene:
          "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

          In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

          - Ray Peat

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
            Yes! This was my experience too. I've been so emotional about it all too lately and I'm not an emotional person. I'm weeping out of compassion for myself if that makes any sense. Keep up the journal, you make me feel like I have a friend along for this journey
            It makes perfect sense. I've been there many, many times in my life! Not right now though... though I am really starting to see the amount of hatred I have for myself and that does make me quite sad. The crux is that feeling that that is a choice, but because it's one we made over, and over, and over - over many years, means it's deeply ingrained and hard to undo. I've been trying for many years... feels like this is another level! Anyway, very glad to have you as a friend on the journey too I'm eternally grateful to you for starting this whole process. Hugs

            Originally posted by Zach View Post
            A couple things.

            Most thermometers are crap. Instead of the temp, keep track and look for trends. Make sure to do same place and time.

            Your ravenous hunger is exactly like what happened to the men who underwent the Minnesota starvation experiment. Even months after it was over, most of them could never get enough to eat no matter how much they stuffed themselves. Your body does crazy things under stress.

            Im amazed at the amount of food you consistently put down, bravo! You are truly doing your body good.

            Check out #whatwouldBillysay? - Blog hes got some really interesting ideas on how much people should really be eating.

            Have you tried a spoon of sugar and salt under your tongue when you cant sleep? It worked wonders for me when i was still struggling.

            Lastly, i know it is easier said then done byt try not to fight your body so much. Calling yourself fat and whatnot, your body loves you and is just trying to do what it thinks is best. Most women wage war on their bodies trying to force them to be slim by sheer will, your body will always win in the long run so best bet is to give it exactly what it needs and hope it thanks you by doing what it should. Also you are your body so this paragraph sounds funny but you get what im saying.
            Hey Zach, thanks so much for the advice. Re. the thermometer - I'll try measuring with another one and see how that goes. But so far the temps are pretty consistent, and they kind of makes sense. I'm always cold, but I'm just used to it. I'll check out that site and I'll put a bowl of salt beside my bed tonight

            Ugh, thanks, but I'm still wishing I wasn't eating so much! Every day I keep hoping that I won't feel so hungry, but it hasn't happened yet. I'm giving in to myself, but I'm also still struggling with it. I know hating my body is not helping me at all... but it's so hard not being perfect, you know? I'm aware that's a ridiculous statement, and that no one / nothing is perfect, but that's the programming that I'm contending with.

            I really appreciate you taking the time to give me advice and offer support. It's unreal that you and Derp are regarded as trolls on this site - you're both complete sweet hearts. Thank fuck you guys came along or else I would still be eating 3kgs of brazil nuts a week and killing myself with PUFA, ha
            Last edited by YogaBare; 09-25-2013, 04:15 PM.
            "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

            In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

            - Ray Peat

            Comment


            • #36


              3k brazil nuts?? Talk about salenium overdose!

              Remember to add sugar to that bowl of salt. Mix it maybe 4:1 sugar/salt and just use a tsp as soon as you wake up, directly under tongue. If you cant do table sugar for some reason, try honey or dried fruit.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
                Awwwwwwww! You're the sweetest Derp.

                Btw, your sig totally reminds me of this Simpons scene:
                Women are so cruel ;_; I remember that episode, back when the Simpsons was still good
                Make America Great Again

                Comment


                • #38
                  Just stoppin' by to say hi.

                  I've been reading.

                  Wishing you all the best. Many hugs.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Graycat View Post
                    Just stoppin' by to say hi.

                    I've been reading.

                    Wishing you all the best. Many hugs.
                    Thanks Graycat I appreciate that. Hugs back to you!
                    "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                    In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                    - Ray Peat

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      E.M.T.W.L

                      Entry Nine: Crash is a beautiful-sounding word


                      Every day is different. Today some strange things happened:

                      - "I'm full" signals kicked in for the first time in many, many years.
                      - I cried, a lot.
                      - I wasn't able to binge.

                      Normally when I feel pain I turn to food to help me. Today, I was in a perpetual state of choking back tears, but even though I wanted to binge, I literally wasn't able to. I ate less than other days (still a lot), but I feel completely stuffed.

                      I wonder if new pathways are forming in my brain. Because the overeating is difficult emotionally, is my brain slowly stopping from associating food as a tool to escape from pain?

                      Sleep:
                      Quite good last night: 11.30am - 7am Hopefully more tonight...

                      Temperature:
                      Took it a few times - average temp was 35.85C (96.53F). Tomorrow I'm going to visit my parents for a few days, I'll try taking my temp with thei thermometer and see if it makes any difference.

                      Exercise:
                      I'm discontinuing the exercise section! I don't have the strength right now.

                      Food:
                      CALS |FAT | CARBS | PROT
                      3481 | 184.2 | 326.4 | 144.4

                      Coconut meat, fresh 100 grams
                      354 33 15 3
                      Egg, whole, fried 3 medium
                      228 18 1 16
                      Salmon, canned 213 grams
                      277 12 0 43
                      Creme Fraiche low fat 70 grams
                      114 11 3 2
                      Mussels, cooked 450 grams
                      676 37 20 62
                      Fig, raw 240 grams
                      178 1 46 2
                      Olive oil 5 tablespoon
                      597 68 0 0
                      Rice, cooked 3 cup, cooked
                      638 5 131 13
                      Orange, raw 1 medium (2-5/8" dia)
                      62 0 15 1
                      Honey 3 tablespoon
                      192 0 52 0
                      Sugar, raw 3 teaspoon
                      46 0 12 0
                      Banana, raw 1 large (8" to 8-7/8" long)
                      121 0 31 1

                      I had a weird experience at breakfast this morning. I had eaten half a tin of salmon and was finishing my third fried egg, when I heard a very distinctive "Enough". I don't know if other people (with a healthy relationship with food) get this all the time when they eat? It was like my body verbally telling me not to eat any more. So I didn't - I put the rest of the salmon in the fridge.

                      I NEVER don't finish things... unless I'm restricting. In fact, I never get signals from my body that it's had enough! The only time it happens is when I binge so much that I'm nauseous and in physical pain.

                      And the thing is, I was still hungry today. So I ate, but every time I had to stop eating cos' I was getting full. That hasn't happened yet on this experiment.

                      I felt so sad all day that I wanted to binge to make myself feel better. But when I thought about it, I really didn't want to eat more food. In the past, binging gave me a sense of relief and pleasure, and it would give me respite from the pain: until the next morning, when it would transform to crippling depression. Now every meal makes me sad. With every bite of food I'm reminded of where things have come to: this act of desperation, this surrender of all control, this stab in the dark. Food isn't making me feel good.

                      And at the end of the day:
                      I'm dreading seeing my mum tomorrow. She always comments on my appearance and gives me "helpful" suggestions on how I could "look better". The most recent one is something to do with my teeth.? I don't really listen anymore. But I'm terrified she's going to comment on my sudden aging, and weight gain. She's commented on my wrinkles before (told me I "ruined my skin"), but has never given me hassle about my weight. In fact she's always told me I was too thin. My sister used to get the flack from her. My sister also has an ED

                      To be continued...
                      "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                      In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                      - Ray Peat

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Sounds like you're taking the power and excitement out of the binge. Like it's no fun anymore since it is allowed now. Good stuff. Good luck with your mum. If it helps, I used to place an imaginary plastic bubble where her words and actions couldn't get out to bother me. It really worked well. She could say anything and I just didn't care.
                        PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
                        http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
                          Sounds like you're taking the power and excitement out of the binge. Like it's no fun anymore since it is allowed now. Good stuff. Good luck with your mum. If it helps, I used to place an imaginary plastic bubble where her words and actions couldn't get out to bother me. It really worked well. She could say anything and I just didn't care.
                          Thanks PM Yeah, I feel like something is changing... which is good. How are things going for you?

                          Things are going well with my Mum. To be honest, we have a good relationship, but this only happened in the last two years, and my attitude to her is residually defensive, even though she has changed a lot in her behaviour towards me.
                          "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                          In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                          - Ray Peat

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Cierra
                            Don't worry about your "verbal regurgitation," this is your journal and you should very well document your emotions and feelings on any and every level! It really helps to read them back to understand the course of your experiment fully and remind yourself of the point of your journey. It really might seem like you're eating too much, and maybe it would be a lot if your body had never experienced stress in relation to food, but since it's been deprived of nutrients for so long, and finally, it has them, your body may very well be screaming for nutrition for a long time. My only bit of advice is to definitely listen to the hunger signals, but try to feed that hunger with the most nutrient dense foods you can get your hands on.

                            As for you not really knowing what result you're looking for in your experiment -- that's okay, too! A lot of people start down a path looking for one thing, getting a bit lost on the way, but discovering something else that's just as well, maybe even better than what they were searching for in the first place! You may end your quest for "normalcy" with food because you learn how to distinguish hunger pangs from loneliness/anger/fatigue/etc. as soon as the emotion arises; you may find that a certain combination of macronutrients is PERFECT for your health and happiness; you may find that your body settles at a weight higher than what you may not believe to be ideal but makes you feel absolutely energized... or an infinite number of alternate endings that we could discuss forever. All's I'm saying is that I honestly think that the benefits are going to be greater than the consquence (which is only gaining weight. not the end of the world contrary to popular belief, and very fixable.) Keep your chin up and weather through this bout of hardship, better times are SURE to come.

                            (Also, if you want me to stop flooding your journal, we can start to private message one another if it's more comfortable for you. Or... I can just leave you be and be a silent cheerleader, haha. I'll always be routing for what's best for you!)
                            Hey Cierra,

                            Sorry for the late reply to this one - it slipped under my radar somehow! Thank you sooo much for the advice - I know I have to keep going through this even though it's hard... but I actually am starting to feel some kind of hope because I am seeing that every day is different. This is completely new terrain, and that's positive, because I'm not just doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results (that's how Paleo Mom started the whole "Women who eat a ton without gaining" thread

                            And you're so right that answers come in ways we don't expect. This experiment is a journey, and it brings something new every day. I had two strange experiences over the last two days, that make me think my attitude to food is changing. Obviously it's early days yet - I know I need to keep this up for much longer than I originally planned, so we'll see what happens. The journal is brilliant to have as a catalog.

                            DON"T feel like you're "flooding" my journal! I love your input and it's great to have you on my side. Go team, eh?
                            "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                            In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                            - Ray Peat

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
                              Thanks PM Yeah, I feel like something is changing... which is good. How are things going for you?

                              Things are going well with my Mum. To be honest, we have a good relationship, but this only happened in the last two years, and my attitude to her is residually defensive, even though she has changed a lot in her behaviour towards me.
                              I'm good thanks. Huge turning point actually. I realized that in an unfortunate coincidence, I started eating sprouted potatoes around the same time I started this new way of eating. My fatigue was getting worse and I had a few days where I was only out of bed for a few hours and heart palpitations were starting and getting worse all the time. I finally started noticing that it was worse right after the potatoes. I looked up potatoes and palpitations and read about the connection with sprouted potatoes. I had thought all I needed was to peel them really good, but I guess the whole potato is garbage. Glad I figured that out! I've continued to eat non sprouted potatoes with no problems. About 24 hours after the last sprouted potato my energy came right back and the palpitations went away. Now I'm wondering how much of the fatigue was the extra calories and how much was the darn sprout potatoes! No more 50# boxes of pototoes!! I'm not super energetic but I do feel about as good as my previous "mild energy" days were.

                              I finally reached the 1 month mark, so now I can compare my body temp to the same time of my cycle last month. I'm consistently .5 a degree higher!

                              Sorry if that was too much for in your journal!
                              PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
                              http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
                                I'm good thanks. Huge turning point actually. I realized that in an unfortunate coincidence, I started eating sprouted potatoes around the same time I started this new way of eating. My fatigue was getting worse and I had a few days where I was only out of bed for a few hours and heart palpitations were starting and getting worse all the time. I finally started noticing that it was worse right after the potatoes. I looked up potatoes and palpitations and read about the connection with sprouted potatoes. I had thought all I needed was to peel them really good, but I guess the whole potato is garbage. Glad I figured that out! I've continued to eat non sprouted potatoes with no problems. About 24 hours after the last sprouted potato my energy came right back and the palpitations went away. Now I'm wondering how much of the fatigue was the extra calories and how much was the darn sprout potatoes! No more 50# boxes of pototoes!! I'm not super energetic but I do feel about as good as my previous "mild energy" days were.

                                I finally reached the 1 month mark, so now I can compare my body temp to the same time of my cycle last month. I'm consistently .5 a degree higher!

                                Sorry if that was too much for in your journal!
                                Not too much at ALL! I love all the input from everyone - it's making the journal an experience encyclopedia And it's great to hear how you're doing.

                                That's so weird about the spuds... It's a shame in a way, as it would be interesting to know what you're energy would have been like without them. I'm feeling less and less inclination to exercise: mostly because I'm feeling really tired, but because I feel uncoordinated in this new body, and too embarrassed to get into my bikini for a swim

                                That's amazing about your body temp! I'm looking into this a lot more now... very interesting stuff.

                                Originally posted by Knifegill View Post
                                Not sure what you mean by "solidly". As for nutrient dense, yes. I had no idea I was so deprived of basic vitamins. I was eating a LOT of liver for - I forget now - weeks, or months. And it was an angelic moment the day I realized I didn't want any, I'd saturated my body with B vitamins and more, and my constant urge to eat, eat, eat was suddenly held at bay. My whole body feels heavier now, I am solid, my bones take more work to move through space and my muscles have grown to move them. It's a whole new body!
                                That's great Knife Yeah, by "solidly" I mean clean and steady. So glad you're feeling better and better!
                                Last edited by YogaBare; 09-25-2013, 04:16 PM.
                                "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                                In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                                - Ray Peat

                                Comment

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