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Primal wife equals primal life. Itchy's Primal Journal

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  • #31
    Can you stay at your location? Or would you want to? That's a killer schedule.
    My Primal Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread53052.html

    "Freedom from fear" could be said to sum up the whole philosophy of human rights. - Dag Hammarskjold

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Siobhan View Post
      Can you stay at your location? Or would you want to? That's a killer schedule.
      I wish! We are staying at the closest available hotel, and no work camp available. Luckily we are moving locations tonight and will be working for a different client. They have a work camp available to stay in - it should cut my day by 2hours per night

      The only downside to a workcamp is that I lose dietary options. I filled my grocery cart with some Primal snacks to bring into camp just in case my options are TOO limited.
      "It's a great life, if you don't weaken.". John Buchan

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      • #33
        Feb 6 - Just over 5 weeks in.

        Sick of the night shift, but at least my drive is down to less than 30min each way. I have enough energy to resume Convict Conditioning in my room, but can't wait to get back to the gym!! Need to lift something heavy.

        Camp food so far has been pretty good. Bratwurst yesterday with tons of beets and saurkraut. Breakfast is easy as they cook eggs to order and always have bacon.
        "It's a great life, if you don't weaken.". John Buchan

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        • #34
          Home!!!!

          Managed to stay 100% Primal during my time away on the night shift. Did convict conditioning when my work/drive dropped below 15hrs.

          I cant wait to get myself back into the light of day, spend some time in Lala's cave, play with the cavelings, and go lift heavy. Two days off then back to the patch.
          "It's a great life, if you don't weaken.". John Buchan

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          • #35
            Hi itchy! Great journal! I have recently befriended your lovely wife. Nice to meet you! My hubby works in the patch too. We live in Saskatoon. He is a week in and a week out as he and my son own the business and they share duties. Nice for me and the remaining spawn! Having hub home every second week. He is at Elk Point right now and Wabasca. I do all his cooking for him cause the camp food was heavily laden with sauces. He is very low carb to paleo, and I am hardcore paleo and an intermittent faster. He said that the Husky camps are like resorts compared to most and one of our employees is loving the food there. But this kid exists on lasagna and pizza normally so we can't go by that. Hubby is going to go check it out next time he's in the area. But hes moving around a fair bit so hard to rely on camps for food in that respect. In the meantime I do a boatload of precooking before he leaves for Alberta every 2 weeks. You were very patient with people and their oil field questions. Glad i found your journal too. Now I can stalk you both BAW hahahahaha.

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            • #36
              Hey itchy! Hey lala! Nice to be home, you and me both - I took off for a week with the Crabblets and just got back. Awesome job with the food!! I caved a bit during the week... But it wasn't really horrible - we had a suite with a full kitchen, and we cooked all meals in, like we always do, due to two of my progeny having special diets.

              I still have questions, if you are still willing to play with me. Have you ever personally seen a fracking site where the fracking fluids leaked back up and/or out of the drilled shafts? I don't need to know the location/name.
              I have a mantra that I have spouted for years... "If I eat right, I feel right. If I feel right, I exercise right. If I exercise right, I think right. If I think right, I eat right..." Phil-SC

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Khaleesi View Post
                Hi itchy! Great journal! I have recently befriended your lovely wife. Nice to meet you! My hubby works in the patch too. We live in Saskatoon. He is a week in and a week out as he and my son own the business and they share duties. Nice for me and the remaining spawn! Having hub home every second week. He is at Elk Point right now and Wabasca. I do all his cooking for him cause the camp food was heavily laden with sauces. He is very low carb to paleo, and I am hardcore paleo and an intermittent faster. He said that the Husky camps are like resorts compared to most and one of our employees is loving the food there. But this kid exists on lasagna and pizza normally so we can't go by that. Hubby is going to go check it out next time he's in the area. But hes moving around a fair bit so hard to rely on camps for food in that respect. In the meantime I do a boatload of precooking before he leaves for Alberta every 2 weeks. You were very patient with people and their oil field questions. Glad i found your journal too. Now I can stalk you both BAW hahahahaha.
                Thanks for dropping in. I feel for your husband working up in Wabasca, I've managed to avoid the area my whole career. I specialized in a service used mostly on natural gas wells, and Wabasca is more oil. Its a challenge in the camps for sure, and not only are things sauce-laden, there tends to be lots of pre-packaged stuff. Over the years, the quality of food in camps has gotten much better however. I was in an Encana camp in Northern BC (by the Yukon border) for a few months last year that was excellent - lots of fresh fruit and vegetables, good salads, and good quality whole foods. The camps will change if we demand more from them, but its a slow process.

                I have been doing some IF myself lately, partially because it is convenient with the crazy schedule I just came off. I am having pretty good success with it as well. My diet is actually strictly Paleo (ala Robb Wolf) as opposed to Primal (like Mark).
                "It's a great life, if you don't weaken.". John Buchan

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Crabbcakes View Post
                  Hey itchy! Hey lala! Nice to be home, you and me both - I took off for a week with the Crabblets and just got back. Awesome job with the food!! I caved a bit during the week... But it wasn't really horrible - we had a suite with a full kitchen, and we cooked all meals in, like we always do, due to two of my progeny having special diets.

                  I still have questions, if you are still willing to play with me. Have you ever personally seen a fracking site where the fracking fluids leaked back up and/or out of the drilled shafts? I don't need to know the location/name.
                  Good to see you back. I hope your escape was a good one.

                  I'm not sure how much you know about fracking, of the geology of oil and gas deposits, so I will go into that somewhat first.

                  A conventional oil deposit is generally found in a porous formation, often sandstone. The sandstone "zone" that has the oil and gas (and salt water btw) trapped in it is "capped" by a non-porous formation like salt for example.

                  The pressure of all the earth above the "zones" pressurizes the oil and gas between the microscopic pores of the sandstone, but it cannot escape to the surface, as there are no pores in the salt "cap" through which it can travel. (Picture the sandstone as a giant oil soaked sponge that has an impassable cap over it. The sponge is being squeezed by the thousands of tonnes of dirt above it.) When a drilling rig comes along and drills down through the cap, the pressurized oil and gas would rush up the pipe, and blow-out all over the place. These are the "best" types of wells, as it does not require much effort (energy) to get the hydrocarbons to surface. These are the dramatic wells from years gone by like the famous Spindletop in Texas.

                  Eventually we got good at not blowing oil everywhere, so the spills were fewer, but we were still mostly interested in this type of well. Over the years, we have exhausted most of these fields all over the world. (The infamous Macado well in the Gulf of Mexico was like this, off-shore is now where you will find the remaining high-pressure zones).

                  Anyway, in order to prevent the massive blow-outs from days gone by, they began to control the pressure by pumping heavy fluid "mud" while they were drilling. The weight of the mud could hold down the pressure until the well could be "cased".

                  The casing is the "drilled-shafts" that you are asking about. Casing is run into the hole down into the producing zone, and cemented into place. The casing and cement are engineered to be as strong or stronger than the surrounding geography, and they prevent the oil and gas "leaking back-up" (or blowing-out) anywhere other than up the casing itself.


                  I will resume this post tomorrow. Bed-time.
                  "It's a great life, if you don't weaken.". John Buchan

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by itchy166 View Post
                    I will resume this post tomorrow. Bed-time.
                    Until the next, whenever you are ready. Sleep tight, and thanks again!
                    I have a mantra that I have spouted for years... "If I eat right, I feel right. If I feel right, I exercise right. If I exercise right, I think right. If I think right, I eat right..." Phil-SC

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                    • #40
                      Back to fracing...

                      So I left off with a conventional well with a casing cemented in place. Casing is run close ended, so the next step is to "shoot" holes in it at the desired depth (across the producing zone). A tool is sent down the well to the desired depth, and charges are set off to punch holes in the casing. This gives a pathway for the hydrocarbons to get into the wellbore, where it can then be controlled and collected at surface.

                      Not all conventional wells have enough pressure for the oil to flow to surface, so various other technologies are used to help it along. Pump jacks, screw jacks, and other downhole pumps are used to get the oil moving up hole.

                      As these easy wells became harder and harder to find, different technologies were developed to help the oil or gas get out of the formation and into the wellbore. Enter hydraulic fracturing.

                      There are two important qualities that the producing zone must have in order for us to produce the hydrocarbon and get it flowing into the wellbore. The first one is porosity (picture our sponge again). The second quality is permeability. Permeable formations allow the tiny pockets to flow into each other. Some rocks are porous and permeable like sandstone, some are porous and non-permeable like shale, some are neither like salt, others are different scales in between.

                      Fracturing provides added permeability to formations that are non-permeable or have low permeability. Pumping fluid into the formation at very high pressures cracks or fractures the rock providing pathways for the oil to flow between the pockets. One problem with this is that when the pumping has stopped, the fractures close back up again due to the weight of all the earth above them. There are a few ways to counter this. The first is to pump acid down the well. The acid etches the rock along the fractures, so they can not easily close. (This was first used in the 1940's I believe). Another way is to pump sand down the hole along with the fluid. The sand travels along the fractures, and then holds the fractures open when the pumping stops. (Interestingly, the sand that is now used is often engineered so that the sand particles are all the same size, and all round. Round uniform sand is easier to flow around.). The size of a frac job is usually measured by the ton. A two ton frac for example pumps two tons of sand.

                      Fracturing in this manner has been very widespread for the last fifty years. Much science has gone into the technique, and there are different mixes of chemicals, acids, fluids and sand that go into the frac depending on the type of formation. These different "recipes" are proprietary, and the exact mixtures are trade secrets. I am not a geologist, nor am I involved with fracing directly, and I do not know exactly what goes into them. I know that some can be oil based and some water based. Also, there are some pretty toxic mixes.

                      to be continued...
                      "It's a great life, if you don't weaken.". John Buchan

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                      • #41
                        Back to frac...

                        So far, we've looked at pretty conventional sources of oil and gas. We looked at formations that are porous and permeable that have a non-permeable "cap" preventing the oil and gas from naturally migrating to surface. We have drilled vertically through the cap, cemented casing into the well, then opened up the casing to produce the resource. We have looked at fracing to increase the permeability of a producing zone, allowing a greater amount of the oil and gas to get into the well bore.

                        Because we have a well that is vertical, when we frac the producing zone, the fractures radiate out horizontally outwards from the casing (mostly). This is important, because the non-permeable cap has remained whole preventing any oil and gas from seeping towards the surface. The only path it can go is into the casing where we can control it. (Remember this.)

                        Shale gas and shale oil.

                        Shale gas and oil is different from the resources we have talked about so far in a couple of important ways. First of all, many of the shale zones ARE the cap from more conventional zones. Shale is porous, so it HOLDS the oil and gas, but because it is non-permeable, it does not allow the oil and gas to migrate through it. Other than the shale itself, there does not need to be a non-porous cap above it to keep the oil and gas in place. Shale is so effective at holding the oil and gas, that it is very difficult to produce at all. Fracing the shale in a vertical well does not open up enough of the resource to be economical. So, the wells must be drilled horizontally.

                        Wells are drilled vertically to the shale, and then are turned horizontal for many thousands of feet. The well follows allong inside the shale, and casing is again cemented into place along the entire well. Many wells are drilled and radiate out from a large pad.

                        The casing is then perforated in stages all along the horizontal section, and the well is frac'd in many stages along this section as well. Remember that the frac's are measured in tons of sand? Well in the conventional wells, I remember being at location when there was a 5-10 ton frac going on. In a horizontal shale well, the frac's in a single well can measure in the multiple hundreds of tons. (More trucks, more pumps, more fluid, more sand, etc..)

                        All of the multiple wells on the pad are produced in the same way, and hopefully (to the oil company anyway) all of the space in between the different wells becomes fractured. This means that there are now pathways not just leading outward from one well as before, but now there are multiple pathways spread out between all the wells. In this manner, enough of the shale resource becomes available to make things economical.

                        Pollution.

                        So now, we are back to the original question. Have I seen frac fluids coming back to surface through the well and spilled all over the place? The answer is no. For this to happen, something on the surface would have to break to allow the frac fluid out. Technically it could occur, but it would be very rare. The oil companies do however use waste water ponds that could potentially leach into rivers or streams. Another more sinister form of pollution would be the deliberate dumping of the used frac fluid into waterways. And the third potential for pollution is the migration upwards from the shale itself.

                        Remember that I said that the shale doesn't necessarily have a cap? A shale zone not only does not need a cap, but we are now fracturing it vertically. Remember that the pipe is horizontal - so our fractures are now radiating out in directions that include UP. This is important because it is technically possible to fracture all the way through the shale zone, and into the zone above it. If this happens, and the upper zone is permeable, there is now a path for the oil and gas to migrate upwards. It will migrate upwards until it reaches a new layer of non-permeable rock. In this manner, underground aquifers could be potentially contaminated.
                        "It's a great life, if you don't weaken.". John Buchan

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                        • #42
                          What about contamination of underground aquifers? In CO, there are places where people's water now has flammable gasses in it and you can literally light the water coming from the tap.

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Mud Flinger View Post
                            What about contamination of underground aquifers? In CO, there are places where people's water now has flammable gasses in it and you can literally light the water coming from the tap.
                            You didn't read the last paragraph of my last post.
                            "It's a great life, if you don't weaken.". John Buchan

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by itchy166 View Post
                              You didn't read the last paragraph of my last post.
                              You are too right sir! Thought I'd read the whole post but obviously not. So what is the best protection for people in these areas that use well water?

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Mud Flinger View Post
                                So what is the best protection for people in these areas that use well water?
                                Hi Mud Flinger! We have a well. We live in tight, rolling hills, and our house is sited on top of one of those hills. Our well is about 265 feet deep. Aside from some small lakes (and not many of those), there is little natural running/standing water in this corner (year-round - I am not counting snow melt or spring rains) and it is rural enough that simply most of the county is on well water, that if your house catches on fire, you had better have a full swimming pool or a farm pond to help out - otherwise your house is ash.

                                Anyway, the answer, I fear, will be this: simply no fracking. Just to protect the water - take zero chances with it. I am beginning to get the nightmarish vision that it won't be long before we end up with contaminated water in the county, and then all those family farms around here won't be worth shit. At that point, I hope everybody got their jollies out of their new cars and whatever nonsense they used their signing bonuses for, because nobody will be able to live here after the water goes.

                                The other day I saw a photo, it was on the front page of the (weekly) local town newspaper, of the county engineer and some other county officer, and there were pins stuck in the map which represented all the new wells/pad sites in the county... there were multiple pins in each and every township in this county. Remembering what itchy said about horizontal drilling (I knew about that, itchy just gives me tons of detail and puts it all together so well), that pretty much means that very soon nearly every square inch of the deep geology under this county will be pumped full of pretty much poisonous crap. And less or more poisonous is wurst to me - contaminated water is contaminated water, the degree matters not once that happens - neither you nor your animals can drink it either way.

                                I know I feel like Chicken Little right now. But the more I learn, the more I feel justified.

                                We love it out here, but I seriously am contemplating moving before the shit hits the fan, i.e. my property is still worth something in this oil boom. Because of the oil, land prices have gone UP for the first time since the first English crossed the Appalachians into the Ohio Country.

                                Itchy is probably getting tired of my ranting, but I have a kid who cries every time she leaves the house - the pipeline people are digging up our road as we speak, because my neighbor two plots of land down signed when we wouldn't, taking truckloads of her beloved trees with them (even if they were on the neighbor's land and not ours). Which, btw, can never be allowed to grow there again (at least while the pipeline is there) - roots and all, you know.
                                I have a mantra that I have spouted for years... "If I eat right, I feel right. If I feel right, I exercise right. If I exercise right, I think right. If I think right, I eat right..." Phil-SC

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