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Journal of a Weary Dragon

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  • #31
    No I'm a bad journal-er. I do like to stalk everyone elses though!

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    • #32
      I have been stalking to. Would be nice to find someone doing PB or EMF that has had steady weekly loss (don't care how small) to goal & stayed there. I'm beginning to think no such person exists!
      Last edited by Ddraig Goch; 02-09-2013, 08:59 AM. Reason: add NB

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      • #33
        Friday 9/2 Cals 1414 ratio 16-4-80 sleep 5.5hrs

        Have started adding 2 brazil nuts/day to increase serotonin.

        Came across the Precision Nutrition coaching website today. One of the success stories showed a woman who lost 68lb (about the same amount I needed to when I started VLC) and her before photos could have been mine, especially as she took them in underwear with the head chopped off just like I do. The after photos showed all the saggy bits gone & has given me great hope as one of the things I fear most is that having lost the weight the body still wont look tight & hot. This is the first set of before & after photos that I can really relate to so I printed them off & have stuck them up for inspiration. Now I have some idea of what I am working towards (yes I know she has not got washboard abs but the stomach is flat & I don’t suppose she did simply fit or the PB 4 essential moves for her exercise)
        Last edited by Ddraig Goch; 02-09-2013, 12:24 PM. Reason: added numbers

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        • #34
          Sat 10/2 Cals 1588 ratio: 15-3-82 Sleep 7.5hrs

          Have had a very picky day today – lots of snacking. Also been very tired all day despite the good sleep. Could be from doing nothing & also finding pain in shoulder, arm & neck very wearing.

          Couple of things re menus:

          a) I think I should be including at least 15g coconut oil for the healthy MCT (supposed to aid weight loss) & at least 1 tsp EVOO for the omega 3 (not sure fish oil sup is enough)

          b) My new omelettes are not working - 1 yolk & 1 whole egg do not provide enough liquid & I find myself still hungry after eating it. Never used to be the case when I was having 2 whites & 1 whole egg.

          c) I also want to properly include a hot coco, as I’m drinking them anyway & then having to rearrange the menu around them. Maybe if I had 1 planned I would not wan it so much

          Have analysed the menus & can add an extra yolk to the omelette & incorporate the other changes whilst keeping to the proper 62g protein, 78% fat & an average 1400 cals. Will wait until Monday when I weigh before going this high with protein & cals.

          NB: Stupid, stupid, stupid Having managed to ignore craving for hot coco at 7:30pm finally gave into 288 extra cals of fat (2 tsp mayo & 2oz cream cheese) at 10pm. Really fancied chicken & boiled eggs so it could have been worse. At least it was only??? Calories - I kept the ratio right & didn’t over do the protein. I have to get this no eating in the evening under control. Although I think the cause this time was really the constant pain in my arm & neck. It’s really getting on my nerves. Should have just gone to bed but I was watching a TV program & the set in my bedroom is broken. Next time I will just go to bed. Am really annoyed with myself. Still tomorrow is a new day.
          Last edited by Ddraig Goch; 02-09-2013, 03:26 PM. Reason: update cals & add NB

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          • #35
            Sunday 10/2 Cals 1535 ratio 15-3-82 sleep 6hrs drop off to sleep ok just woke very early don’t feel particularly rested.

            (NB: have updated the numbers as I hit the mac nuts again late last night - did nothing for the ratio & added 150 cals to the total. I have got to stop staying up late at night)

            Have found a really good website for low carbers. They have a really good post re NK and the danger of sticking to a too low protein level:

            High Fat NK 80/15/5 - February Version - Low Carb Friends

            This post also reviews Dr. Phinney’s book ‘The Art and Science of Low Carb Living’ in which he seems to contradict himself.

            In ‘The A&S of LCL’ he apparently says minimum protein should be between 1.5 & 2g per kg of HSIS & total cals should be 30g/kg of HSIS for very sedentary & 35g/kg for normal people

            So for my HSIS of 137lb (62kg) my protein intake should be between 93-124g & calorie maintenance should be between 1860-2170

            But this isn’t the same as his views in ‘The A&S of LCP’ in which uses 0.6-1/lb LBM to calculate protein requirements & BMR to calculate calories. For my current LBM of 102 lb & TDEE for a sedentary person (based on LBM) my protein intake should be between 62-103g & calorie maintenance should be between 1648-1888.

            I can only assume that the A&S of LCP was brought out later & thus he has refined his numbers further. I think I will stick with this set of numbers as I think working protein & cals out using LBM is likely to be more accurate than using total body weight given that it’s the LBM that uses the protein & burns the cals.

            All this number crunching has been useful though as it has made me reassess my own macros. In my earlier post I said I was going to use 62g protein & 1488 cals.

            Originally posted by Ddraig Goch View Post
            I guess I have got to accept the numbers 62g protein 1488 cals
            The protein is fine but the cals was based on the optimal diet formula of Carb = 0.5 x Protein, Fat = 2 x Protein. I struggled with this as the carbs are too high for me & I was struggling with the high cal count.

            So I used my BMR as cals excluding any activity & lowered the protein so I could keep to 80% fat. However I was not really happy & reading the above post re the dangers of lowering the protein level too far I’m even less happy.

            But after re-reading the relevant bits of ‘The A&S of LCP’ today I have realized my mistake. I should be using my BMR (based on LBM) + activity level to determine my overall cals & not the optimal diet formula. This means that as my LBM goes up so will my cals.

            [NB: This post from the same Low Carb website talks of the dangers of going too low on the cals, something which I have been struggling to change my mindset with (I think this post has finally switched the light bulb on – who wants to train their body to use less cals for life?)

            High Fat NK 80/15/5 - January Version - Low Carb Friends]

            So to get back to my macros:

            Protein is 62g = 248 cals
            Total cals = TDEE –20% for weight loss

            BMR (based on LBM) is 1373 x .8 (<20%) = 1098 so:
            1) TDEE (sedentary) = 1098 x 1.2 = 1318 (for days with no activity)
            2) TDEE (light ex) = 1098 x 1.375 = 1510 (for days when I do walking/sprint/LHT with bodyweight)
            3) TDEE (mod ex) = 1098 x 1.55 = 1703 (for days when I LHT with weights or run for >1hr - both along way off but something to aim for!)

            Fat @ 80%:
            1) 1318 x .8 = 1054 cal, 1054/9 = 117g
            2) 1510 x .8 = 1208 cal, 1208/9 = 134g
            3) 1703 x .8 = 1362 cal, 1362/9 = 151g

            Carb:
            1) 1318 – 1054 – 248 = 16 cal, 16/4 = 4g - will need to make sure I use a good multi vit if I have many of these days
            (another reason to up the exercise)
            2) 1510 – 1208 – 248 = 54 cal, 54/4 = 14g
            3) 1703 – 1362 – 248 = 93 cal, 93/4 = 23g

            So ratios (P-C-F) are:
            19-1-80 cals 1318 (for days with no activity i.e. rest days)
            16-4-80 cals 1510 (for days when I do walking/sprint/LHT with bodyweight)
            15-5-80 cals 1703 (for days when I LHT with weights or run for >1hr)

            I’m finally happy with these. As my LBM increases so my cals with be adjusted. Great motivator – workout so I can gain LBM & be able to eat more. Also the macros will be adjusted appropriately for the day’s activity.

            Finally, reading the following post about from the SPEED website about how to break a stall makes me realize it is so important to get the protein & cals right in order to stop a stall from happening in the first place:

            How the Hell Do I Break This Weight Loss Plateau? | S.P.E.E.D. - Evidence Based Weight Loss

            PS: Used frozen cream in my hot coco today - it was OK but not the best taste wise. Will buy smaller quantities of cream so freezing shouldn't be necessary
            Last edited by Ddraig Goch; 02-11-2013, 10:13 AM. Reason: update numbers

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            • #36
              Monday 10/2 Cals Cals 1395 ratio 14-6-80 sleep 5hrs could not get warm last night & woke up cold this am

              Weighed today & put on 2lb from last week 176lb (did go down a lb at start of the week & then up again) but here is the interesting thing – although my body fat has increased by 1/2lb (no surprise there my av cals have been up 150 from goal across the week), my LBM increased by 1.5lb even though I have done no exercise whatsoever (DS been taking pity on my bad arm & walking the dog). I was expecting to lose LBM since my protein has been 10+g below what it should be. Will be interesting to see what happens next week. Water% has also increased slightly (a positive thing – when we last checked DD has BF 16% & water 61.7%, mine has increase from 35.2% to 41.9% since then so any increase is welcome. I do not regard it as ‘water weight’) despite not drinking any more than usual. Could these effects be an alternate measure of deep ketosis?

              PS: Have finally thrown my ketostix out – they never have recorded a reading despite me never eating more than 20g carbs.
              Last edited by Ddraig Goch; 02-12-2013, 02:46 AM. Reason: add PS

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              • #37
                Week 2 Roundup So here we are again, the end of another week. Av cals 1368 (+150/day) Av ratio 17-4-79 Fat spot on, protein a little low.

                So what have I learnt?

                1) Having recrunched the cals & ratio numbers to death I finally think I have them set:

                Rest days: cals 1318 ratio 19-1-80
                Normal Active days: cals 1510 ratio 16-4-80
                Weights or slow runs >1hr: cals 1703 ratio 15-5-80 cals (this is off the radar for some time yet)

                2) My 1/2lb BF gain means I really do have to pay attention to the cals especially on rest days– HFMPLC on its own is not the answer (that just confirms what I already new really)

                3) Lower protein may not necessarily cause LBM loss in the first week but I think doing it a second week might & I’d rather try & stay one step a head by consolidating my gain rather than potentially losing it again.

                4) I will not lose LBM if I don’t eat 6 meals a day (still not convinced my metabolism won’t slow to a crawl though)

                5) I’m not very good at keeping to plan. I have not managed to stick to any of my meal plans all week despite being at home (probably the reason why). This is partly due to trying out new things so I’m not too worried but I want to get a handle on this in week 3.

                6) I really do need to get going with the exercise (wretched shoulder!). I’m convinced this is the only way I will see a sustained weight loss

                7) Equal parts olive oil & butter = body fat make up (just for info so I can find it later)

                8) To stop a stall you need to reassess calorie intake against new weight and adjust accordingly. Go hard core for 2wks to make sure your haven’t strayed

                9) Most of my eating is in the form of grazing & not because I’m hungry but because I want to eat something. I don’t feel comfortable with not being over full. I need to ignore this & concentrate on eating when I am hungry not at set meal times i.e. don’t eat because you feel you should – food is fuel

                10) Magnesium oxide (cheap) is useless. Need 1-3tsp mag citrate (preferably in powder form under the tongue as it is metabolised quicker) for toilet issues. Start high then lower the dose as necessary

                11) 1 tsp of cayenne pepper in water with lemon is supposed to help toilet issues. Will try this first.

                So for week 3:
                a) I am going to concentrate on getting the cals right. Once I hit the number I will stop eating for the day (or at least try)
                b) Can’t do LHT but will start on the 5k plan @under 75 HR
                c) Record hunger before/after eating
                d) Start taking Cayenne pepper & up the magnesium to 2 tables a day

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                • #38
                  Tuesday 11/2 Planned Cals 1215 ratio 13-7-80 sleep ?

                  Have planned my meals for today & I want to stick to it. Going to add planned & actual nunmbers in my posts for a bit to see if thst will make a difference.

                  Demuralist is going to try a fat fast but without restricting cals to 1000. I thought about joining her but am worried about the protein level being low so decided against it. Will be interested to see how she gets on.

                  Update: Been back to Dr re shoulder & he said to rest & don't rush back to work (that 's OK but it doesn't pay the bills) so will leave it til Friday then start back regardless. Have got some food to eat up (incl salmon which is hopeless on a HFMP plan with restricted cals as the protein is 6x the fat) so will stick to 1250 cals with 80% fat & forget the protein for the next couple of days & then do a 1 day Fat Fast of 1000 cals just to see how I feel & try & stop the fridge raids.The trouble with HF is you need considerably less food to reach the cal count for the day. This will take me up to Friday when I am back at work so will then try & stick to my planned correct protein meals for the rest of the month & see what happens (note to self - must stop tweaking things)

                  Update2: Ordered a couple of good books today:

                  1) ‘Protein Power’ by Dr Eades, which is supposed to explain how to work out the optimum protein required. If I can get this number nailed then it would be great – too much & I will not burn fat efficiently as I will be creating glycogen, as well as eating unnecessary cals. Too little & I lose LBM

                  2) ‘The High Performance Heart: Effective Training with the Heart Rate Monitor’ by Philip Maffetone. Hopefully this will help me to complete my 5k training plan without hitting chronic cardio.

                  Can’t wait for them to arrive.
                  Last edited by Ddraig Goch; 02-12-2013, 11:00 AM. Reason: Updates

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                  • #39
                    Fat Fast

                    Spent some time today researching the Fat Fast. The basic idea is keep cals to 90% & keep cals to 1000 over 5 meals. (NB: You should weigh everyday as the fat fast is really for people with insulin resistance i.e. who can’t get into ketosis & can’t lose weight on VLC). Some rebound is possible after finishing due to water retention & some LBM might be lost in the process. If I were going to do it I would stop if my LBM started dropping.

                    If I tried to do 90% fat with my required level of protein I would need to eat 2480 cals, way too much. By ignoring the protein level I have managed to put together a menu for 1018 cals with ratio 9-2-89, which would work:

                    1) Feta Omelette – 10g butter, 25g feta, 2 egg yolks
                    2) 80g Cream cheese
                    3) Mackerel in Mayo – 2tsp mayo, 9 olives sliced, 36g tinned mackerel fillets
                    4) 26g Macadamia nuts
                    5) 25g Coconut Oil

                    The higher protein b/fast should keep me full in the morning & the higher protein mackerel meal should work for the afternoon. If I did get really hungry an extra snack of 2tsp EVOO & 10g butter will only bring the cals up to 1173 ratio 8-2-90

                    This would be a good menu for a Saturday rest day as 1 day on the lower protein level shouldn’t be too much of a problem.

                    I also read today that it can take 3wks to start losing weight consistently on an NK WOE so not I’m not going to get too worried about last week’s gain or change anything until the end of Feb but a fat fast may be good for 3-5 days if I hit a stall

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                    • #40
                      Oh God I wish I knew what was most important, 80% Fat, correct protein level or restricted cals. Its impossible to do all 3 & its leaving me depressed & my thoughts keep contradicting each other. Will go ahead with the next 3 days menus as its about using up food, keeping the cals down & seeing movement on the scale. Going back to work on Friday will mean kick starting the exercise & I will not have time for hrs of journal stalking agonizing over menu plans or research so will be more easily be able to stick to my original HFMPLC plan I do realise that its important to stick to one thing for at least a month to see if it is working but then the other part of me think 'yes but if it doesn't work, that's another month wasted. Torment, torment......

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                      • #41
                        The latest diet craze to hit the UK is IF & the latest one being aggressively promoted is the 2 days diet. This basically reduces your calories (while pretending not to by dictating the amount of each food type that can be eaten from a predefined list of foods) & carbs while eating mainly high protein (another stupid low fat diet!) on two days then sticking to a Mediterranean diet for the other 5 days. The difference between this one & the other IF diets doing the round here right now is that the IF days (if you can call it that – they seem to think IF means less calories rather than a defined widow of eating) are consecutive. It is supposed to be proven to help reduce the risk of breast cancer as well & I post this info only because it may make sense to do 2 Fat Fast days within an IF window on consecutive days weekly. This may mean you would get all the benefits of IF & Fat Fast (i.e. lose weight & give body a rest) then consolidate the gains with 5 days of EMF. Might be worth a try.

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                        • #42
                          Tuesday 11/2 cont. Planned Cals 1215 ratio 13-7-80 Actual cals 1280 ratio 10-6-84 sleep 7hrs loo break then 1hr woke up feeling awake for the first time in forever.

                          Since my protein was going to be rather low today (carb count up due to endive & berries) I decided in the end to go for the 3 day fat fast (I know, I Know, I’ve changed my mind again!). I may yet pay for it in LBM loss but what the heck, at least I'll know if it works or not. After 3 days I will be sticking to the planned HFPM meals anyway. Not sure I want to try this for a while whilst working & getting the fitness plan going so now is the time to do it.

                          Am a bit off the 90% today by 84% is better than the 79% I have been doing so it should do some good. Could actually have stopped at just under 1000 cals but wanted to up the fat & use up some cream at the same time.

                          Will aim for 90% & 1000 cals tomorrow.

                          Have also decided to IF at the same time with an 8 hr feed window (started at 09:30 & just finished my last at 17:30 so need an early night I think before the munchies set in. Wish me luck for tomorrow.


                          PS Had a basement clearout today so another reason for trying the fat fast now – I want to see if it makes any difference
                          Last edited by Ddraig Goch; 02-13-2013, 05:52 AM. Reason: add sleep hrs

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                          • #43
                            Wed 13/2 – Fri 15/2 – 3 Day Fat Fast with 16hr IF window


                            OK So I have planned my 3 days (not counting yesterday as the Fat % was only 84%). Demuralist has reported a craving for protein, crappy sleep & no weight loss after 1 day on 90% fat but higher than 1000 cals so will be interesting to see how it goes

                            In the interest of science & since I need to get it out of my system once & for all, I’m going to 1000 cals & an 8hr feeding window (makes sense with so few cals & I want to see what it feels like as well). I'm also hoping this will show me I can stick to a meal plan if I really want to.

                            NB: It has come to my attention over the last few days that carbs of any form are just extra cals. To do zero carb it would be necessary to cut out eggs, something I’m not prepared to do but I feel I could easily leave out the veg carbs. I think once I have finished this experiment & am back on HFMPLC I will eat up what I have left then the way of veg then not buy anymore. I have enough protein & fat here not to have to shop for at least 4 weeks so not having to go buy fresh veg & get distracted into buying other things will help the bank balance too.

                            OK, on with the experiment:

                            Start Weight: 176lb BMI: 28.27 BF: 40.9% Water: 41.9% LBM: 55.6%

                            Wed 13/2 Planned: Cals 1014 Ratio 8-3-89 Actual: Cals 1014 Ratio 8-3-89 Sleep 4hr15 loo break 3h felt tired still when I woke up so laid in bed snoozing for 30min

                            Menu:
                            Cream Cheese Pancakes – 2 egg yolks, 5g unsalted butter, 2oz full fat cream cheese
                            Hot Chocolate with 2 tbsp double cream
                            Cream Double Extra Thick 30ml (3 heaped tsp)
                            Chicken & Mush Soup using homemade stock with 20g unsalted butter
                            Coconut Oil 25g

                            Exercise: Took dog for 30min walk

                            Weight: -2 174lb BMI: 28.03 BF:41% Water: 41.9% LBM 56.0%

                            Very pleased with myself for sticking to the menu. Started eating at 9:30, finished at 17:00 feed window 7:30. Ended up eating most of it in the morning then hung on til late pm before eating the soup with butter. Felt hungry just before bed at 11:30 but it was not terrible & didn't keep me awake. Not particularly hungry when I woke up. Will happily wait until 9:30 before eating again.First time in a 2 weeks I didn't use painkillers when going to bed (could just be a coincidence).

                            Have lost the 2lb I gained last week. Unfortunately most of that is the 1.5 lb LBM I also gained last week + 0.5lb BF. This is what I was worried about with such low protein levels. Still will see it through to the end of the 3 days as am a third of the way in & I wont need to do it again if I'm right & no significant BF is lost.

                            Thu 14/2 Planned: Cals 1000 Ratio 8-3-89 Actual: Cals 1000 Ratio 8-3-89 Sleep 3.hr dog loo break 1.5hr Went to bed very late which didn't help. Not tired this am though.

                            Menu:
                            Feta Omlette – 2 egg yolks, 20g unsalted butter, 25g feta cheese
                            Hot Chocolate with 2 tbsp double cream
                            Hot Chocolate with 2 tbsp double cream
                            Chicken & Mush Soup using homemade stock with 20g unsalted butter
                            Coconut Oil 30g

                            Exercise:
                            Took dog for 30min walk

                            Weight: 174lb BMI: 28.03 BF:40.8% Water: 42.1% LBM 5.8%

                            No weight loss but 0.5lb BF loss & 0.5lb LBM gain. Was a bit hungry last night & very hungry this am but will wait until the allotted time before eating. Stuck to the menu OK. Started eating at 9:30, finished at 17:00 feed window 7:30. Wouldn't want to do this for more than 3 days, especially for so little result. Feel OK mood wise just disappointed in the weight loss.

                            Fri 15/2 Planned: Cals 976 Ratio 10-1-89 Actual: Cals 995 Ratio 9-2-89 Sleep 8.hrs no break.

                            Menu:
                            Feta Omlette – 1 whole egg, 10g unsalted butter, 25g feta cheese
                            Hot Chocolate with 2 tbsp double cream
                            Hot Chocolate with 2 tbsp double cream
                            Chicken & Mush Soup using homemade stock with 20g unsalted butter
                            Coconut Oil 20g
                            Macadamia Nuts 15g

                            Exercise:
                            non - dog not well so no long walk. I was also feeling strange so stayed in.

                            Weight: 174lb BMI: 27.998:30 BF:40.8% Water: 42.1% LBM 5.8%

                            Woke u after the longest uninterrupted sleep I've had in years feeling brilliant. Not hungry at all. Started eating at 9:30, finished at 17:30 feed window 8:00. No change in how my clothes fit.

                            Would I do the fat fast again? Answer No. Although I feel great this am, I felt really terrible yesterday & given no real weight loss I can't see the point in doing this again.

                            Would I do IF again? Definitely This n=1 has shown me that I can a) follow a menu plan b) not eat in the evenings. Snacking in the evening is my biggest problem so I am going to keep the 09:30-17:30 regime up but using my proper protein amount of 62g , up the cals to my BMR (1350) & 80% fat for the next couple of months.
                            Last edited by Ddraig Goch; 02-16-2013, 12:14 AM. Reason: fri numbers

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                            • #44
                              Can't believe how much energy I have got since waking up & not feeling tired. Its the first time I have felt like going near the TM since xmas and I did 20mins at a very slow jog. Doesn't seem to have had much effect on the shoulder
                              Last edited by Ddraig Goch; 02-13-2013, 06:55 AM.

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                              • #45
                                Found this formula tody over on Paelobird's thread about counting calories

                                http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread29501.html

                                It is aimed at determining the LBM (& hence protein reqs) when you are HSIS:

                                1. Start with your ideal BMI. 22 is my aimed for midpoint
                                2. Multiply by the square of your height in metres to get HSIS weight in kg. Eg I am 5'6" which is 1.68m (multiply height in inches by 0.0254) so that gives 22*1.68*1.68=62 kg (funny how I keep coming up with that number)
                                3. Multiply by 2.2 to convert to pounds - 62*2.2=137lb
                                4. At HSIS weight, a woman will have approx 20% body fat. LBM is then (1-20/100)*HSIS. So when hot I should have (1-.2)*137=109.6lb LBM Target protein 109g protein.


                                I am excited about finding this formula because I have often wondered how much LBM I need to add for my HSIS weight. Currently it is 104lb so I now have a target & am a lot closer than I expected. Also it gives me a chance to explore expected body comp as I get closer to my goal:

                                BMI 22 weight 137lb (9st11) BF 20% LBM 109lb, BF 18% LBM 112lb, BF 16% LBM 115lb
                                BMI 21.5 weight 134lb (9st8) BF 20% LBM 107lb, BF 18% LBM 109lb, BF 16% LBM 112lb
                                BMI 21 weight 131lb (9st5) BF 20% LBM 104lb, BF 18% LBM 107lb, BF 16% LBM 109lb

                                Whilst I know the big flaw in all of this is that BMI is the key number it is interesting to get some idea of expected LBM
                                Last edited by Ddraig Goch; 02-13-2013, 12:54 PM.

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