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  • The other thing I found very interesting is this write up about the starvation study done by Ancel Keys during WWII, actually I read the book, but here is the link to the study...They Starved So That Others Be Better Fed: Remembering Ancel Keys and the Minnesota Experiment and from reading Paul McKenna's book "I Can Make You Thin". Each in their own way said that you will do what you have to do to get what your body needs. Unfortunately so many of our foods are devoid or at least deficient of necessary vitamins and minerals that we often end up overeating in an effort to compensate.

    To that add the confusion of our brains knowing we need something but being unclear what that is (sleep, fluids, a hug, etc.) we often eat to fulfill the need.

    I for one, eat too much most days, this I know. The odd thing is that I do not eat processed foods, and I am fairly active, so my situation flies in the face of CW and its SAD, and the idea that if you are obese you spend you time eating junk in front of a tv.

    In the Starvation Experiment, they were restricted to about 1800 calories a day and expected to walk 22 mi a week. Heck, I generally eat 1,400 to 1,700 and walk over 30 miles a week, usually more. They had a few housekeeping chores to do, and could attend classes if they wanted. Their symptoms and the lengths they went to to get a little extra food is very telling, and a little familiar. It is fascinating really.
    Chris
    "Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass. It is about learning to dance in the rain."
    Unknown

    My journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread36279.html

    My "Program": doing my version of a 4:3 - 3 day fast diet with real food every day, with a little twist of anti-inflammatory mixed in.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by demuralist View Post
      All right I am finally caught up, geez, you guys sure are chatty! Anyway, wanted to mention that you can freeze fresh ginger so you can always have it on hand (for your cucumber Thai salad). And congrats on the fast. My body is still not at a point where I don't feel ill if I skip too many meals, someday.
      Thanks for the info! Never thought of that. My life just got less complicated.

      Originally posted by Siobhan View Post
      Yeah, he says something like, "You're as fat as you need to be." Meaning that your body is just doing what it needs to survive on the fuel you are providing. And since our diets have become highly politicized and a source of income/career building/general pissing match, we can be inadvertently providing ourselves with the wrong fuel. I know I was! If you told me 7 weeks ago I would be grain free, I wouldn't even know what you meant! And this is my 6-week anniversary! It is pretty obvious to me, at this point, that FAT is what my body wants. Limiting fat was the worst thing for my mood, my energy, my health.
      Boy, you made up your mind fast! It took me weeks, if not months, to be ready to give it a go.
      Last edited by Judg; 05-20-2012, 04:12 PM. Reason: Punctuation nazi
      5'2", 55 years, Primal since April. Pre-Primal weight loss, from 216.6 to 157.8
      Primal low: 140.2 (Dec. 3) Goal weight: 135?
      Main Primal goal: beating back my CFS enough to function more normally and start writing again

      More and more, our life has been governed by specialists, who know too little of what lies outside their province to be able to know enough about what takes place within it.
      - Lewis Mumford

      Comment


      • Hmm! That'll teach me to tell Coll I'm outta here. Thought I would go quietly (since I can't achieve gracefully). All okay. I suppose it was better to address things instead of leaving. I just get so tired sometimes. M called me 9 times today. It's Sunday!!! She wanted her sheets changed. They do that there for free anytime and also on a regular basis. I tried telling her that when I called her at 4. Mistake. Now she's decided she can't read. She was reading big print books just fine last week.

        And it's too hard to turn her computer on. And she can't turn her tv on. And she needs someone to talk to all the time. I'm almost to the point of moving to Texas -- which I would love except we live here and anything over 75 degress is just not workable for me:-) Teasing. I actually don't expire until about 85.

        Anyway, thanks for posting on my journal, I think:-):-):-)

        I actually ate cilantro-chicken wontons today on a big bed of raw spinach and didn't get grossed out. There could be hope for me yet, although I'm feeling a little uncertain right now. I think perhaps I was a hobbit in a former life:-)

        Comment


        • I'm glad to see you, Lopisheep. Just do your own thing, and don't stress. About the food at least. I think your son's suggestion to just get what you want and feel like eating, is a good one.
          Man, your Mother is a piece of work! 9 calls?!?

          Comment


          • Yay! I'm hungry!

            Finally got hungry yesterday!

            Here's how it went:

            Up at 7:00
            Vitamins
            Water: 16 glasses
            Walking: 100 minutes
            Bed at 8:30

            Started feeling hunger at about 1:30, with a little light-headedness to follow. It came back at 5:00, so I decided it was the real thing. Another bit at 8:30. All manageable, though. I'm planning to continue to fast today, then break my fast sometime tomorrow.

            The two biggest difficulties are the desire for the TASTE of food, an the habit of eating. I am trying to keep busy with things I enjoy doing, and I have done more walking. Today, I have plans in the morning for a long walk to the yarn store- about an hour each way. I get to chose the yarn for the waistband of a skirt I am making. Love buying yarn, but I need to restrain myself, so I haven't done it in a while. In the afternoon, I am going to watch a movie, while I sip my Pellegrino water. And in the evening I am demanding a massage from my honey. Which should lead to other pleasant evening activities. (No chocolate of any variety afterwards, though!)

            Got two books from the library which are giving me some interesting reading. The 'Dukan Diet Cookbook' and the 'Three Season Diet'.

            Dukan has a diet based on all protein days, alternating with protein and vegetable days. I thought there would be a lot of good recipes in it, and there are.

            The Three Season Diet is based on the idea that different diets are suited to different body types, and times of the year. He doesn't present many scientific studies to back it up, but there are a lot of intriguing ideas in it. And certainly, the idea of eating seasonally, fits right in with primal. He also has relaxation tips, and interesting ideas on how and why our bodies use energy based on stress.

            Comment


            • Her record is 14 and she's already left at least one voice mail this a.m. Luckily, she doesn't text!

              I always thought the three season diet was interesting. It'd take some planning because everything out of season is so available in the markets!

              Yes, you are so right about the food. I have a feeling even the most perfect primal diet, the most perfect any kind of diet for that matter, wouldn't work if the stress level was too high.

              Okay, I'm going to get some light reading (German and Russian stuff not being the lightest in the world) after I finish the Night Watch series. Reading it in German. Love it. Russian literature, not to give anyone the false impression, is something I still and probably forever will always read in German, French, Spanish, or English. Russian is one hard language. Don't know why. Chinese and Arabic are easier for me, but I'm not giving up yet.

              Originally posted by Sabine View Post
              I'm glad to see you, Lopisheep. Just do your own thing, and don't stress. About the food at least. I think your son's suggestion to just get what you want and feel like eating, is a good one.
              Man, your Mother is a piece of work! 9 calls?!?
              Last edited by lopisheep; 05-21-2012, 01:56 PM.

              Comment


              • Sabine, I'm impressed.

                Pam, 9 calls? Oh my. *thanks God for reasonable parents*
                5'2", 55 years, Primal since April. Pre-Primal weight loss, from 216.6 to 157.8
                Primal low: 140.2 (Dec. 3) Goal weight: 135?
                Main Primal goal: beating back my CFS enough to function more normally and start writing again

                More and more, our life has been governed by specialists, who know too little of what lies outside their province to be able to know enough about what takes place within it.
                - Lewis Mumford

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Sabine View Post
                  The Three Season Diet is based on the idea that different diets are suited to different body types, and times of the year. He doesn't present many scientific studies to back it up, but there are a lot of intriguing ideas in it. And certainly, the idea of eating seasonally, fits right in with primal. He also has relaxation tips, and interesting ideas on how and why our bodies use energy based on stress.
                  This sounds really interesting! can't wait to hear more about it! Wonder if my library has it...hmmmm will have to check before I go to town next. Like I need something else to read!!! Or have the time right now what with all the canning!! lol

                  have a great day!!!
                  {{{hugs}}}
                  Goal: Don't worry be happy!

                  Comment


                  • I KNEW you would want to check it out, PrimalCajun, even if you were confined to bed!

                    Comment


                    • LOL you know me sooooo well!!! No longer confined to bed (or recliner)...confined to the counter & stove! Canning!! lol No rest for the weary this time of year!!
                      Goal: Don't worry be happy!

                      Comment


                      • Just made your thai cucumber salad, wow-zah! It's all gone now...couldn't stop eating it. I also made Judg's cantaloupe-cuke-feta salad, and ate that too. Guess it was dinner! Must go search out some protein now.

                        I'll have to make up some more for work, hope I can stop myself from eating it all again. Funny, I have never eaten so many vegetables in my life.
                        My Primal Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread53052.html

                        "Freedom from fear" could be said to sum up the whole philosophy of human rights. - Dag Hammarskjold

                        Comment


                        • I'm glad you liked it. I'm looking forward to trying Judg's salad this week. Looking forward to lots, actually, as I AM HUNGRY.

                          Yes, I am.

                          Sat at the table with my family as they ate the delicious grass-fed beef tacos I made for them, and sipped my water, and was hungry.

                          Hungry, I say!

                          But the idea of breaking my fast so late in the day is not appealing, so I am going to wait until tomorrow morning. That will put me at 4 1/2 days, and almost two full days since I became hungry, which seems very respectable to me. I think I need to ask Mark if counting from when you get hungry offers any benefit. My thought was that until I get hungry, I am still feeding myself, just off my glycogen. I suppose, I am still just feeding myself, but out of my fat. Is there a difference for cell regeneration? That's what I am mostly interested in, in these fasts.

                          I feel I could say I am doing these fasts for religious reasons (if anyone asked) because I am taking the possibility of cellular regeneration on faith. Oh, I know there are scientific studies, but there's nothing I can point to in my own body, right now, and say, 'see, here's an effect'.

                          Those pesky cells. Just so small.

                          Anyhow, dinner is cleaned up now, and I feel pretty confident that I won't go crazy, stuffing avocado and taco meat in my mouth.

                          See y'all tomorrow!

                          Comment


                          • Good work and congratulations! You know, I think the best thing is that you are really thinking and integrating the whole process into your total experience. I am sure this is a very positive experience that will show benefits in the future.
                            My Primal Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread53052.html

                            "Freedom from fear" could be said to sum up the whole philosophy of human rights. - Dag Hammarskjold

                            Comment


                            • Speak. The universe is listening.

                              Two interesting things.

                              A few weeks ago, I was looking at my china cupboards. We have Blue Willow as our china. I really am fond of it. It was what we had when I was growing up, and I asked for it for our wedding china, and we've slowly added to it over the years. We don't have regular china and good china, just our Blue Willow, and I use it for everything. Some of the larger platters get displayed on our kitchen wall until we need them at Thanksgiving and Christmas. I was thinking, and said out loud, "I'd really like some more of the salad plates, and the cereal bowls. And the large round servers, and another oval server." Didn't think to mention my gravyboat, although I broke it a few years ago, and could use another.

                              Yesterday, as I was taking my long walk (a bit TOO long, but I made it!) I was musing over my weight loss during the fast. I am not doing this for the weight loss, but when you are overweight, everything comes back to the pounds in one way or another, it seems. I was at 185.5 that morning, and was fantasizing that I would get down to 185 on Tuesday, and stay there. Then I laughed, because everyone 'knows' you don't STAY at the weight you get down to on a fast, you bob up a bit. So I said, out loud, "What I really WANT is to get down to 182.0 tomorrow, and only bob back up to 185.0." Solidly in the 185s, that's the first of my sequential weight goals! A nice fantasy to dream on during my walk.

                              Another mile on, as I was walking through downtown, I stopped to look in the window of one of the little antique stores. Displayed there: a set of Blue Willow, with salad plates, cereal bowls, two large round servers, and an oval server. Plus a few other items. All at a reasonable price. The store was closed, but I'll be back there at opening time this morning.

                              This morning I got on the scale.

                              182.0.

                              I am breaking my fast today and feeling very good about it. I was hungry through most of yesterday, on and off. I WANTED to eat, but I didn't feel desperate about it. Just wishing tomorrow would hurry up. I guess this is delayed gratification. Hmmm. I could get to like it.

                              I have definitely planned some of the things I want to eat. A drumstick and some greens. That taco meat! I'm making Siobhan's Zuccini Thing for dinner tonight. And Judg's salad on Thursday. My traditional Wednesday sashimi. Other things will be added, but those for sure.

                              So, here's the details of yesterday:

                              Up at 5:30
                              Vitamins
                              Water: 16 glasses
                              Walking: 170 minutes (!)
                              Massage
                              Bed at 9:00

                              My energy was good over all. Some tired periods, but also some periods of zip, one of them during my walk, which was rather unexpected. Woke up this morning in a neutral state, but now, half an hour in, I'm starting to feel hungry. Will break my fast sometime after 9:00am.

                              Hmmm, what to have first?!
                              Last edited by Sabine; 05-22-2012, 07:04 AM. Reason: emphasis

                              Comment


                              • What a lovely dilemma! Enjoy!

                                I love your Blue Willow story. We always used Blue Willow when I was growing up, a combination of inherited pieces, supermarket pieces, (Remember those? A different piece on sale every week?) thrift store buys. When my youngest sister got married, that was what she wanted, and so it is still being used by her family. Must be 75 years now.

                                And all will be well -
                                My Primal Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread53052.html

                                "Freedom from fear" could be said to sum up the whole philosophy of human rights. - Dag Hammarskjold

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