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  • I missed the "obsession" question. Sorry Sabine, I think that you are perfectly "normal" in a good way.
    Primal since 9/24/2010
    "Our greatest foes, and whom we must chiefly combat, are within." Miguel de Cervantes

    Created by - Free Weight Loss Tools
    MFP username: MDAPebbles67


    • Guess I'll just keep plugging away

      Rats, I was kind of hoping y'all would say, 'why, yes, Sabine, we've noticed that you don't XYZ' and there would be the obvious thing that would make me lose three pounds a week!

      A girl can dream!

      I went out for lunch at Genghis Grill yesterday, and fifteen minutes after the meal was over, was hit with a headache. It was so abrupt in its onset that I really noticed. Usually, they creep up on me. Makes me wonder if there was something in the sauce that affected me. MSG? It hung on through the evening, and made my workout at the gym very lackluster. I was already skipping the weights so I wouldn't have to grip with my finger, and now my walking got super-slow. At least I was moving.

      I've started tracking (a little) to get into the habit for after my fast. (In case you are not taking notes, I was planning another three day fast for sometime after Eldest's visit, and then to track my macros for a few weeks to see what the heck I am doing. The fast is coming up- probably will start on Saturday.) I was pleasantly surprised to see that on calorie counts, at least, I am a good estimator. My guess for breakfast on Tuesday:800. Actual number:795! I gave myself a gold star.

      A surprise from yesterday is that five sausages and two eggs is still only 22grams of protein. I may be lower than I thought on the protein. I'm going to start playing around with Paleotracker, figuring it out ahead of time (that's the plan, at least).

      Okay, here's what I did:

      Up at 5:15

      8:30 8oz mushrooms
      1t coconut oil
      2C spinach
      1C brussel sprouts with bacon
      5 sausages
      2 eggs (fried in the sausage grease)

      2:45 2 bowls at Genghis Grill, both with the tomato sauce and a little Dragon sauce
      beef and vegetables
      seafood, pineapple, and vegetables

      8:30 1/2 apple
      2T almond butter
      1oz salami
      bite of steak fat

      65 minutes of walking

      Water: 10 glasses

      Bed at 9:30

      I'm getting faster typing with my finger held out of the way! Since I hunt-and-peck(even after three summers of typing classes), it works.


      • Hunt-and-peck - ha ha ha! Love that, DH is a hunt-and-peck typist so will have to use that on him soon I love reading your journal ... nothing weird that I can see as far as your eating. (or anything Just keep fiddling with your macros and hopefully you'll keep that fat coming off. Each of us is so unique in needs and likes that it really is up to us to figure out what works for us. I am in the throes of fiddling and like you, realising that some things don't have as much protein as I had hoped. Am going to pull out my organic whey powder and start adding that to a drink during the day to try and up my protein. Otherwise I just can't quite get to my protein goal at the moment. Figure I have it - might as well use it.
        Start weight: 225.5 lbs Feb 14th 2012. Height: 5'7"
        Primal low: 186 lbs
        Current weight: 221.4 lbs
        Goal weight: 140 lbs

        "You are free to choose, BUT you are not free from the consequences of your choices."


        • Course I am really new at this so I should just stay quiet, but I have found that protein is the hardest to get right. It doesn't come in the nice neat packages like fat and carbs do. Protein likes to come with fat, and I find it hard to balance them the way I would like. At the end of the day, I find I haven't had enough protein and that is not as easy to correct as fat, which I can pour out of a bottle, or carbs - apple anyone? If only there were a protein apple! Luckily we eat a lot of fat on this diet or it would be impossible.
          My Primal Journal:

          "Freedom from fear" could be said to sum up the whole philosophy of human rights. - Dag Hammarskjold


          • I've even thought I should get some of that 99% fat-free! ground turkey (ugh, what's the point-give me some fat!) to add to my ground beef to up the protein while keeping the fat level. Surely if it is coated in some lovely beef fat, that will help with the taste.
            Please, someone tell me I'm right. I find it hard to believe I used to eat that stuff all the time. It has ZERO taste.

            Siobhan- You've inspired me. I stuck my computer up on a box to be standing instead of sitting. I share a computer, so it has to be something I can take down easily, but every little bit helps, right? If I can stand during the week days when the family is not sharing, that's a start.


            • My supervisor used paper boxes to pick his computer up off the desk b/c he hurt his back (has to get toradol shots periodically to numb the pain). A guy in another office built him a really nice wooden "box" for lack of a better word to place his computer on. He said that even after his back is better, he'll probably remain standing.

              I add ground pork to our ground deer meat. Adds extra protein and a bit of fat to our burgers (deer dries out so badly b/c there's zero fat anyway, the pork makes it moist like a hamburger), so I think adding turkey to your ground beef would be ok. it would add little flavor but lots of protein!

              MSG makes my gut unhappy for several days. I used to LOVE going to a specific Chinese food restaurant near home until I realized for the next two days my gut wasn't pleased with me. Found the same to be true of my favorite steak house. I noticed the same effect after eating Johnsonville Brats. JVBs have MSG in them. So now I get the brats from the grocery deli which they claim has no MSG. I have heard MSG can cause migraines too. Likely the Genghis adds MSG to it's beef.
              Last edited by jenn26point2; 05-17-2012, 08:29 AM.
              Primal since March 5, 2012
              SW: 221 | CW: 204 | LPW: 166 | UGW: 140 (80 lbs loss)


              • I'm having a hard time upping protein without getting too much fat too. I did notice though that on days I eat smoked fish (lox, mackerel, trout, eel) at lunch instead of meat fat is lower and protein much higher. Like today I didn't eat meat, but smoked fish at lunch and roasted salmon at dinner and I'm at 85 g protein and 71 g fat!
                My Journal: Candy in Primal Wonderland
                My Blog: Candy in Wonderland
                Goal for 2012: keep weight steady (+/- 74 kg): check
                Goal for 2013: lose 10 kg and keep new weight (+/- 65 kg)


                • Hey, maybe you'll inspire your family to stand up at the computer! I'm really liking it, it adds variety.

                  I have salmon for dinner tonight, hope it helps my protein % for today. I always try, regardless of actual grams, to eat, in order, Fat - Protein - Carbs. It is easy for the carbs to sneak past the protein even at relatively low levels. And protein is just so darn filling. Funny, I probably eat less meat than a lot of CW eaters do.
                  My Primal Journal:

                  "Freedom from fear" could be said to sum up the whole philosophy of human rights. - Dag Hammarskjold


                  • Too much food, too little sleep

                    Here's yesterday:

                    Up at 6:00

                    9:15 8oz pot roast
                    1/4C gravy (w/ 1t flour)
                    1/2C thai cucumber salad
                    1C mixed greens(chard,mustard,beet,turnip) cooked with onion and bacon

                    12:30 4 slices ham (8gC!- what the heck?!)
                    4T herbed cream cheese
                    1 Brazil nut
                    1 fried banana
                    1T butter
                    1T vanilla

                    1:00 shot of ascorbic acid

                    2:45 1oz chocolate
                    3oz blue cheese

                    3:30 ganache
                    nuts and dried fruit

                    6:30 chinese chicken fajitas
                    chicken thighs sauteed in coconut oil
                    italian dressing
                    sour cream

                    8:30 nuts and seeds

                    30 minutes walking

                    Water: 9 glasses

                    Bed at 11:00

                    I am never buying that brand of ham again! I made myself what I thought would be a pleasant lunch, and instead set off sugar cravings for the rest of the day. When I looked at the package I flipped! The ascorbic acid kept the cravings at bay for a little while, but I neglected to keep taking shots, or getting away from the kitchen, or something. It was all primal, but way too much. I think part of it was spending so much time on the computer (very close to the kitchen). I am going to limit myself to three check-ins, today, see if that helps. Late morning, late afternoon, and evening, if my daughters aren't monopolizing it.

                    And then, I was enjoying my book too much, and the next time I looked up: 11:00! At least all that snacking gave me plenty of energy.


                    • Starting my next fast

                      I woke up feeling very stodgy after my excessive eating on Thursday. My plan had been to start my fast on Saturday, and I could feel the littlest tickle of a suggestion working its way into my mind: Since you're going to be 'super-good' soon, why not be 'super-bad' first?


                      This is not the way I want to go.

                      Also, I don't want to approach my fasts as calorie-reduction. These are not for eating less, they are for giving my body a rest. And, then, from some more rational part of my mind came the thought: Fasts are used to feel better, too, aren't they? And you feel a little 'off' this morning. Why not...crazy idea... just start your fast NOW?


                      I jumped on it, and before I could talk myself out of it, wrote it down on my paper journal, and told it to my honey. I moved some of the activities I had planned for Saturday to keep myself busy, up one day, and started.

                      Of course, with a fast, that means, really, I refrained. So, I have a very short post for yesterday:

                      Up at 6:10
                      Water: 12 glasses
                      Walking: 130 minutes
                      Bed at 8:30

                      Some thoughts from while I was walking, on the different kinds of hunger. (We should be like the Eskimo, and have different words for it, like they do for snow.)

                      Mind Hunger (
                      and its henchman, Sugar Cravings)-wanting to EAT! So insistent and bullying. It makes you do things you don't want to, and you feel ashamed and dirty afterwards. And it won't leave you alone for a MINUTE. You can fight it off with tricks and tools, and it always comes back. Even after you have banished it from your life for months, it is always waiting its opportunity.

                      Mouth Hunger-mmm, it all looks and smells so good. Such a flirt of a hunger, always ready to engage with every single piece of food that goes by. So gregarious, it is open to anything, even once we have told it (firmly) that grains aren't food, sugar is not food, no, legumes aren't food, except for once a year-get-over-it. But Mouth Hunger does not get over it. It holds a grudge, and keeps account of all the food it has been denied, determined, to one day, EAT IT ALL!

                      Stomach Hunger-the growling empties. In my SAD life, how often did I ever get to this point? I was eating too often to BE hungry. I was afraid of it, and yet, this is the politest kind of hunger. Your stomach growls. You feed it and it is happy, or you say, 'not now' and it quiets down and tries again after a couple of hours. A reasonable, well-behaved hunger.

                      Body Hunger-lethargy and light-headedness. A resourceful kind of hunger, because if you ignore this, it just goes to your body, and helps itself. Fat mostly, a little protein if things go on long enough. It is done talking, it is all about ACTION! But it holds no grudge against YOU: it doesn't pester you, or make you crazy. It is the kindest of thieves, actually, making you feel good with ketones while it goes about its business. And since most of what it is stealing is from the midden heap (so to speak) we're very understanding about it all.

                      Last time when I fasted, I didn't have Stomach Hunger until 47 hours into my fast. I went into it from several days of perfect primal eating, not after a carb-fest, so I don't think I can expect quite the same result this time. I know Mouth Hunger (and one I forgot, Habit Hunger) have been making their presence known already, but the bully of the group, Mind Hunger, has stayed away. Frightened off by Resolve, perhaps, which I have borrowed while GayPanda is off to Minnesota.

                      Sorry. My need is great.
                      Last edited by Sabine; 05-19-2012, 04:50 AM.


                      • LOL! I like it. I've been busy sub-dividing fatigue, but you have done a lovely job with hunger here. Congratulations on sticking to it. I do find, myself, that breaking a fast in the evening is a bad idea, I wake up the next morning ready to eat the fridge out.
                        5'2", 55 years, Primal since April. Pre-Primal weight loss, from 216.6 to 157.8
                        Primal low: 140.2 (Dec. 3) Goal weight: 135?
                        Main Primal goal: beating back my CFS enough to function more normally and start writing again

                        More and more, our life has been governed by specialists, who know too little of what lies outside their province to be able to know enough about what takes place within it.
                        - Lewis Mumford


                        • Love your post on the different kinds of hunger. Especially hard when they hit one all at once!

                          Amazing how we all read labels most of the time, and then the one time we don't read them because we get something from Whole Foods and forget that WF's has lots of yucky stuff along with the good stuff -- oh, yeah. Most annoying. My youngest son, strict vegetarian, reads all labels. He got some mushroom and vegetable thing the other day. Looked vegetarian but it was made with chicken broth. I was cleaning the freezer and wasn't sure whose section it went in. Read ingredients. It said chicken broth, so I assumed it was my husband's section. Luke says: "That's actually mine." I told him about the chicken broth and he freaked. Though he was going to throw up as he'd eaten some of it!

                          And everytime I forget to read a label, it has a migraine trigger in it. It's just hard to get everything whole sometimes.


                          • Yes, I will definitely avoid breaking the fast in the evening. One thing I found interesting last time, is that when the appointed time for ending the fast came, I really wasn't that interested in eating. I felt I could have gone another day with ease, and just stopped because I had a definite plan. I think the fear and anticipation of hunger, is much greater than the actual event.

                            That ham incident really ticked me off. I grabbed it out of the sale bin, because the package looked similar to one I usually get. Plus, I had a coupon for it, so I was excited. Not such a bargain after all. MUST READ ALL LABELS!
                            Last edited by Sabine; 05-19-2012, 08:59 AM. Reason: cross-post addition


                            • Oh, I forgot. I started a fast this a.m. too. Probably should try to figure out what kind of hunger I have right now. You get up even earlier than I do, so you're even further along.

                              How long are you planning to fast?


                              • I have a thread I am using on the Nutrition page, 'Planning a fast - anyone interested' originally started by Nady, if you would like to join in for support.

                                My plan is to go three full days. However, last time, I did not get Stomach Hunger until 47 hours in. So, I am considering marking my three days from whenever I get to that point. Just considering, though. I'm at 38 hours right now.

                                My last food was at 9:00pm on Thursday, which would take me to Sunday night, but no night-time breaking of the fast for me. So Monday morning will be my ending time, possibly longer.