Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Primal Journal (RMS)

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Fats. Limited. Beef fat, pork fat, ghee, a little butter. Egg yolks. Small amt of sun butter, but I'm pretty sure I should only have that on special occasions. Eating is getting to be a PITA

    I'm going to see what a week of calorie cycling does. I'll go from there. I feel better on a pretty much animal diet. Maybe I just need to focus on that (mostly animals) and cycle calories (while keeping am eye toward protein - but with a little more give).
    -- Ruth

    Comment


    • I saw this over on low carb friends. It makes sense. Something for many of us to think about...

      Why the scales can lie

      A biologist at Berkeley shared something very revealing on the low-carb BBS system about 4 years ago that helps us all through the erratic weight fluctuations you invariably encounter: Fat cells are resilient, stubborn little creatures that do not want to give up their actual cell volume. Over a period of weeks, maybe months of "proper dieting", each of your fat cells may have actually lost a good percentage of the actual fat contained in those cells. But the fat cells themselves, stubborn little guys, replace that lost fat with water to retain their size. That is, instead of shrinking to match the reduced amount of fat in the cell, they stay the same size! Result - you weigh the same, look the same, maybe even gained some scale weight, even though you have actually lost some serious fat.

      The good news is that this water replacement is temporary. It's a defensive measure to keep your body from changing too rapidly. It allows the fat cell to counter the rapid change in cell composition, allowing for a slow, gradual reduction in cell size. The problem is, most people are frustrated with their apparent lack of success, assume they have lost nothing, and stop dieting.

      However, if you give those fat cells some time, like 4-6 months, and ignore the scale weight fluctuations, your real weight/shape will slowly begin to show. The moral of the story - be patient! Your body is changing even if the number on the scale isn't.

      PATTERNS OF WEIGHT LOSS

      Common patterns of weight loss from tracking a lot of people who become assimilated into the low carb lifestyle, a pattern emerges.... the 2 week induction is pretty heady...weight lost just about every single day, enormous and unbelievable amounts of weight loss are reported. This is often followed by complaints that weight loss "stalls" or that the rate drops to only 1 pound per week.

      Many people just don't know that fat-loss ...the actual goal when on a weight-reduction" diet, is rate-limited. In other words, the human body has factors that prevent more than a certain amount of fatty-acid release from storage...and even more factors that prevent those released fatty acids from being used up instead of stored back into the fat cells.

      A priority of the human body is survival. Anything that threatens its survival results in the cascade of events to maintain the previous status quo. Water fluctuations are one way the body does this. OK...so you done good on Atkins' during induction...lost 10 pounds the first 2 weeks. Maybe 7 the first week and 3 the second. But, whoa! Weeks 3 and 4 there is NO loss! And weeks 5 and 6 is only 1/2 pound each!

      So... what gives? Initially, the body jettisons the water attached to the glycogen stores that we diligently deplete to get into ketosis...this accounts for about 3-5 pounds of water. In addition, muscle stores of glycogen are not being replaced when used...which will account for the rest. All in all...MAYBE 1/2 pound of fat was metabolized during the first week... and MAYBE 1/2 pound of fat was metabolized the 2nd week. Of that 10 initial pounds, only 1 pound was fat and 9 pounds water...

      The body senses this lack and sirens start shrieking: Warning! Warning! Losing water... new thing...got to get back to the status quo! Brain tells body to produce and release that vasopressin anti-diuretic hormone....more water is retained, and no weight loss noticed. Fat loss is still occurring, MAYBE even 2 pounds per week, because ketosis is firmly established and appetite suppression is in effect...but water retention is hiding that continuing fat loss. The body is preventing dehydration with this mechanism, and that's a good thing.

      From the perspective of the scale, it can be discouraging. Which is why the mantra: Water retention masks fat loss (repeated frequently to oneself) is helpful. Water retention will mask ongoing fat-loss for as long as the body retains the water. We can combat this by drinking more water...but we aren't going to totally overcome this mechanism during the initial water-loss phase of the Atkins diet. By weeks 5 and 6, things start to get back in balance, and the scale will begin to reflect the true fat-loss...which, as mentioned before is rate-limited.

      Individuals vary, but max weight loss runs about 2 pounds per week...under extremely optimal conditions... or 1% of body weight (whichever is the lower number). So don't use the scale as an excuse to undermine your progress. Even when the scale is in a stall, fat loss can be occurring.
      __________________
      -- Ruth

      Comment


      • oh wow...
        Karin


        Created by MyFitnessPal.com - Free Calorie Counter

        What am I doing? Depends on the day.

        Comment


        • Well my heart really wants to believe it. I stayed on the SSoS with the 10 veggies a day for 5 months with no change. I am committed to getting in and staying in NK, lets say till at least the end of the year.
          Chris
          "Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass. It is about learning to dance in the rain."
          Unknown

          My journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread36279.html

          My "Program": doing my version of a 4:3 - 3 day fast diet with real food every day, with a little twist of anti-inflammatory mixed in.

          Comment


          • Very interesting about water retention. Different from bloat, and even more sneaky, but reassuring, in a way.

            I posted a review about the Alternate Day Diet (JUDDD) on my journal, if you want to take a look.

            Comment


            • re: article above. I both agree and disagree with it. I think it's right on in terms of why we often see a "stall" right after the first 2 weeks or so. And, at that point, I usually start trying to tweak. I suspect if I would stay the course -- and not jump into cashews -- it would turn itself around. When I lost my first 20 pounds on primal, I would say that the article was spot on. I didn't ever really have a fast or crazy weight loss, but I "knew" it was working. Of course, after the 20 pounds, I was "stuck" and then I tried every different thing under the sun and moon and stars. I wonder what would have happened if I had just been patient and stayed with what I was doing if I eventually (after my body rested) would have started losing again. I feel like I've gotten so lost along the way.

              Anyway, yesterday was actually a good day. For all that I "fell" into the cashews, I didn't feel like it was a binge. I enjoyed the day and enjoyed what I ate. It was a refreshing change. I enjoyed having an "up" day. Today is a low day. I think it will be a mental challenge more than anything. My body is very used to eating at the same time. Sometimes I think my desire for a schedule and consistency has hurt my ability to determine "true" hunger. We shall see. I'm giving this calorie cycling thing 2 weeks.

              Today's weight: 161.4. Not bad after a big "up" day. [My most recent hold was 158.6, but my "new" hold has been around the 161 mark.]
              -- Ruth

              Comment


              • Sabine, nice summary. I have decided to give it a 2 week try. If nothing else, I hope it breaks my body of its "schedule" a little bit and shakes things up. We shall see how it goes..........
                -- Ruth

                Comment


                • on your down days are you keeping the same macro percentages as the up days.

                  I will ask you what we have been asking Karin and Paula, did you track during your successful 20 pound loss? If so what did the food/calories/macros look like then? Lets get back to the basics and repeat the successful things and use the unsuccessful as learning experiences.
                  Chris
                  "Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass. It is about learning to dance in the rain."
                  Unknown

                  My journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread36279.html

                  My "Program": doing my version of a 4:3 - 3 day fast diet with real food every day, with a little twist of anti-inflammatory mixed in.

                  Comment


                  • Yes, that is my goal, to keep my percentages the same.

                    When I lost those 20 pounds, I was not tracking. I was - surprisingly for a girl overweight her entire life - just able to listen to my body. I do, wonder, however, how much of the loss was due to healing my body. I had been gluten intolerant (and feeling the symptoms for at least a year) before I switched to primal. But I can tell you what I ate pretty regularly:

                    B: leftover steak and maybe veggies
                    L: eggs and spinach (cooked in olive oil)
                    D: steak and one veggie (usually something green - nothing starchy)

                    I had denied myself steak (and red meat in general) for so long, that I kid you not we ate steak 3 or 4 times a week. The rest of the meals were some variation of red meat - I bought of 1/4 grass-fed cow and just pulled a hunk out every day. I basically lived the Whole30, without calling it such. My "treat" was shredded cabbage, 1/2 apple, and unsweetened almond butter, mixed together. I ate around 1,400 calories (I did track for my Whole30).

                    I actually think it was pretty low carb, mostly animal products, and decently high in fat (but protein was a little higher than now). Interesting, huh?
                    -- Ruth

                    Comment


                    • yes, very interesting. I would think about repeating it for a few weeks to see what happens. I feel like because of your dietary restrictions it may be that you need to do more protein to make your nutrition needs? Instead of trying to increase fat so much, just concentrate on the fatty cuts or using some herbs in your ghee as a "sauce" for the leaner cuts. I am a quantity girl though, so I would have to do a green salad at dinner (3oz of mixed greens is a big pile of food). Maybe use coconut oil to cook at lunch and olive oil for dinner (just to mix up the sources a bit).

                      I dunno, just thinking out loud.
                      Chris
                      "Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass. It is about learning to dance in the rain."
                      Unknown

                      My journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread36279.html

                      My "Program": doing my version of a 4:3 - 3 day fast diet with real food every day, with a little twist of anti-inflammatory mixed in.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by RMS123 View Post
                        re: article above. I both agree and disagree with it. I think it's right on in terms of why we often see a "stall" right after the first 2 weeks or so. And, at that point, I usually start trying to tweak. I suspect if I would stay the course -- and not jump into cashews -- it would turn itself around. When I lost my first 20 pounds on primal, I would say that the article was spot on. I didn't ever really have a fast or crazy weight loss, but I "knew" it was working. Of course, after the 20 pounds, I was "stuck" and then I tried every different thing under the sun and moon and stars. I wonder what would have happened if I had just been patient and stayed with what I was doing if I eventually (after my body rested) would have started losing again. I feel like I've gotten so lost along the way.

                        Anyway, yesterday was actually a good day. For all that I "fell" into the cashews, I didn't feel like it was a binge. I enjoyed the day and enjoyed what I ate. It was a refreshing change. I enjoyed having an "up" day. Today is a low day. I think it will be a mental challenge more than anything. My body is very used to eating at the same time. Sometimes I think my desire for a schedule and consistency has hurt my ability to determine "true" hunger. We shall see. I'm giving this calorie cycling thing 2 weeks.

                        Today's weight: 161.4. Not bad after a big "up" day. [My most recent hold was 158.6, but my "new" hold has been around the 161 mark.]
                        This.. I always think this and then of course dismiss it. Staying the course when you are not seeing evidence of progress is tough and frustrating. I think we need to just push through it.. its very hard though.
                        Karin


                        Created by MyFitnessPal.com - Free Calorie Counter

                        What am I doing? Depends on the day.

                        Comment


                        • not weighing daily made it easier for me to not tweak the program on a near daily basis, but I also lost a piece of information I cannot get back. Wondering if I lost weight in the beginning and then gained at the end or if I was gaining all along. Data lost.
                          Chris
                          "Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass. It is about learning to dance in the rain."
                          Unknown

                          My journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread36279.html

                          My "Program": doing my version of a 4:3 - 3 day fast diet with real food every day, with a little twist of anti-inflammatory mixed in.

                          Comment


                          • ^^^ this is what I am thinking
                            Karin


                            Created by MyFitnessPal.com - Free Calorie Counter

                            What am I doing? Depends on the day.

                            Comment


                            • My problem - I can't always look at the results as data. I think I did something either "good" or "bad". And, truth of the matter, the scale fluctuations could be from 2 or 3 or 4 days ago...but I don't know that and always think it relates to what I did yesterday. But, I didn't have a scale for years. I ended up at 240 pounds. Should I have known by the way my clothing fit? Yeah. But I was in denial.
                              -- Ruth

                              Comment


                              • well, I was getting on the scale, not daily but every couple of weeks, and ended up at 290! Talk about denial.

                                I am talking myself into it being a data point. That is easier now that I lost a couple of months worth of data.
                                Chris
                                "Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass. It is about learning to dance in the rain."
                                Unknown

                                My journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread36279.html

                                My "Program": doing my version of a 4:3 - 3 day fast diet with real food every day, with a little twist of anti-inflammatory mixed in.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X