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Groktimus Primal's Experience

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  • Groktimus Primal's Experience

    I'm a modern man from Massachusetts. I've always looked toward science and the future for answers. I've never been one to buy into religion or any concept that did not seem well grounded in fact. I was once about 400 LBS and with the help of low carb dieting I lost over 200 LBS however over many years I gained half of it back because I allowed the carbs to creep back into my life. I like Mark's reasoning and approach. I now consider myself a low carb primal lifestyler. I plan to post things I discover and interesting tidbits here as well as my weight and thoughts. -Jim

    Began 11.01.10 @ 274 LBS
    Today 09.20.11 @ 219 LBS
    -Transform!

    Groktimus Primal's Experience

  • #2
    Groktimus Primal's Atkin's vs. Primal

    I know there are articles on this topic already but having recently read the Blueprint and everything I could get my hands on by Atkin's I feel the need to compare the two. I think that for those in need of serious weight loss that a thorough understanding of both is very helpful.

    The Primal diet is a bit more liberal with the carbs but really not much if people stop treating Atkins like the induction phase is the entire diet. Also Atkin's always recommended sticking to whole foods even though he sold bars and shakes. Atkin's also recommended organic and grass fed foods as preferable and was pretty much against the consumption of grains. True he was more liberal with cheese and legumes not caring what time period such things became available to mankind.

    He also advocated exercise in the form of play. His choice was tennis. Many folks seem to think he was anti-exercise. He considered supplementation a requirement of the modern diet.

    Atkin's said his diet was a three legged stool of diet-exercise-supplementation. Now the Primal diet does make it more of a lifestyle by addressing sleep and types of exercise and even sun ex-poser. When you put the two diets together to customize it for personal preference and needs it is truly awesome.

    Anytime I eat I consider what I like in relation to the carb count, nutritional content, whether it's a whole food and if my body can handle it based on Primal evolutionary concepts and experience. This has been a winning combination for me and pretty soon it is a thoughtless habit.

    That is why I now call my lifestyle Primal Low Carb!

    -Jim
    274/219/150
    -Transform!

    Groktimus Primal's Experience

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    • #3
      Groktimus Primal's -The Talosian Trap

      The Talosian Trap

      Alright this is a truly geeky reference in the title! For those of you more fortunate (who have lives) I will explain the reference from Star Trek. The Talosians were a race of beings who had evolved to such an extent that they reached the point of causing near self extinction. Their mental powers were so great that they had mastered the art of creating illusions. As a result they fell prey to an easy lifestyle of generating illusions for entertainment and lost the ability or desire to strive for anything else. Pretty much they created mental television! If they had also created McDonald's they would have definitely been extinct much sooner.

      I have learned (although late in life) that the path of least resistance often leads to more pain and suffering in the long run than the so called difficult path. This is a perfect analogy for a low carb primal lifestyle. Certainly the pain of illness and decrepitude involves much greater suffering and cost than the annoyance of eating healthy and getting some exercise. It is sometimes difficult to sacrifice a bit of immediate happiness to leverage the future. Keeping that in mind is the key.

      274/219/150
      Last edited by jfrendek; 09-22-2011, 07:28 AM.
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      • #4
        Groktimus Primal's - The Scariest Thing

        The Scariest Thing

        I remember reading in the Blueprint Mark stating that perhaps the scariest single piece of information is the realization that you are on your own. Not many people know or will tell you the truth about food and of course most of us know that corporations and politicians can't be trusted.

        When I think of how many years I wasted looking for a dieting solution it's safe to say I threw away if not the majority of my life then at least the best years. Then I stop and think about all the other people all over the world who have basically had their kneecaps broken by the self serving lies of special interest groups.

        It may well be time to return to our past and maybe even implement some sort of population control. It sounds extreme but I wouldn't want to be born into a world that is intent upon slowly poisoning me to death for as long as I manage to live.

        The thing that struck terror into me when I finally understood what was happening is the brainwashing of children. I did at a reasonable age learn that certain foods/products were not healthy but I did not know enough to help with my addiction to carbs.

        To a child in today's world they learn through osmosis from their environment and experience what is "normal". If you grew up being bombarded with junk food commercials and eating junk then you believe it is normal and don't really think to question it until you are older and in deep crap.

        Teach the children well and don't have too many seem to be the best ideas to me. Just like religion, they get them while they are young otherwise you would never believe such tall tales once you reach adulthood without the proper "conditioning".

        274/219/150
        Last edited by jfrendek; 09-23-2011, 06:11 AM.
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        • #5
          Groktimus Primal's - Natural Selection

          Groktimus Primal's - Natural Selection

          The thought had crossed my mind when viewing life competitively (such as seeking employment) but it never really sank in until Mark said the Primal Blueprint could be classified as an elitist diet because we are all still competing for survival by hunting and gathering the best this overpopulated world still has to offer.

          Knowing that, I guess it would make sense and be highly profitable for money hungry corporations to corner the market of food production and misdirect us at every turns so we don't even understand what good food is so we can not properly seek it out even if it was affordable.

          If you can keep people weak, poor and uneducated (especially without them realizing it) you certainly have a winning combination if selfish gain is all you desire. Natural selection only changes form it does not go away. Perhaps it would with a truly enlightened race which I doubt humanity will ever achieve. (we don't seem to be trying very hard. I guess it's not "profitable").

          It's especially bad when our own genetics are used as a weapon. Food companies know what is addictive (just like big tobacco) and they use this to ensnare us. By the time we figure it out we are forty years old and sucking eggs. (or a "downer cow" as Mark would say)

          Mark's recent link to Cracked.com's food posting talked about them using wood pulp in muffins. My grandmother use to eat Hollywood diet bread which contained sawdust! The truly scary thing is that this is probably one of the relatively good additives. It most likely acts as fiber and does not get absorbed rather than being toxic or adding non-nutritive calories.

          New or old, snake oil is snake oil and it's always been around just perhaps not in high quantity. I am not looking forward to living in the third world country American is becoming.

          274/217/150
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          • #6
            Groktimus Primal's - Primal Pets

            Groktimus Primal's - Primal Pets

            As I began applying Primal consideration (on top of the low carb consideration) to my diet a thought occurred to me. The cat was screaming for food as he does every ten minutes all though he is certainly fed too much as it is. It then occurred to me that the dog lives to eat and is fighting a weight problem he does not want to win. Everyone (I think) takes for granted that all pets are pigs by nature and many will eat until they puke if given the chance. I instantly thought that the food manufactures are probably taking advantage of "dumb" animals and ignorant owners by doing the same thing to them that they do to us. Namely feeding them a bunch of empty carbs to produce a cheap product that would then set the pets up on the same blood sugar roller coaster and drive them to eat voraciously every chance they get. As far as I know pet foods have almost no regulations. I don't think they even have to tell you what it's composed of. I certainly know the corporations aren't going to look after an animal's best interest if they don't bother to do that for humans.

            I googled Primal Pets and came back with this link...

            Primal Pet Foods: Wholesome Raw Food for Dogs and Cats

            I am not affiliated with the company nor have I tried it's products but I would love to hear from someone who has. I suspect we will find pets are in the same boat we are with even less people advocating for them. Most people probably haven't even given it a thought. We are taught pets are suppose to eat "pet food" just like Milk, Juice, Toast and Trix are part of a complete breakfast for those who wish a slow fat death!

            274/217/150
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            • #7
              Groktimus Primal's - Those Who Can't

              Groktimus Primal's - Those Who Can't

              What does it take to be a health and fitness expert? From my observations the only true requirement is that you must look good or as Mark would say "Look Good Naked (LGN)". I see it all the time, people who were never fat and likely naturally gifted mesomorphs are instantly experts. In my opinion these people are often less credibly than people who are still out of shape but made significant strides to overcome their natural endomorph tendencies.

              The other thing I see happen is even worse. Someone manages to lose weight and instead of being truthful they realize they can't fight "Conventional Wisdom" and become immediate sell-outs in order to become marketable.

              The Biggest Loser is the perfect example. The show (like most TV) is designed to entertain and it makes making fun of fat people even more socially acceptable (being fat is the only thing Political Correctness has not caught up with) than it already is. Do you think for one moment if Jillian did not have a killer body or she used the words low carb or Primal too often that she would be on the show? Does anyone really intend to keep up that kind of exercise output and strict eating when they get home? Jillian even endorses weight loss pills. I seriously doubt any pills significantly helped her get where is today and if they did it was certainly not something over-the-counter.

              Having said all that in disgust I must say I have watched some of the shows and found humor in the suffering and indignities that take place even though I could have been a contestant for many years myself. Also I can't really blame her or anyone else for selling out. If someone came to me and said "Endorse these bogus products and you won't have to worry about earning a living" I might do one of Mark's all out sprints trying to find a pen

              274/218/150
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              • #8
                Groktimus Primal's - Extorted Protection Money

                Groktimus Primal's - Extorted Protection Money

                Most people are in agreement that our healthcare system is broken on so many levels. Mark pretty much said that they only treat the symptoms (often poorly) and almost never the root cause of illness or prevention. Taking a drug is like sticking your finger in a dike, the problem just erupts in a different location. I don't think most people want to read another diatribe about all the problems but I have noted some sickening things.

                Let me describe my insurance situation in Massachusetts. I see about $50 a week fly out the window and I assume my employer is probably kicking in at least as much but probably more. I'm actually lucky as I only have a $1200 deductible of course it still doesn't pay a whole hell of a lot if you manage to meet the deductible. Really the insurance is only worthwhile if I get hit by a bus.

                So why do I buy the health insurance? Aside from getting old and fear of something catastrophic I have some interesting and in my opinion criminal reasons...

                1. Extortion - Massachusetts makes you buy health insurance or they raise your taxes. They literally force you to buy a crappy product whether you can really afford it or not.

                2. Protection Money - Most Doctor's won't accept you as a patient without insurance even if you can pay out-of-pocket. The system is rigged.

                3. More Protection Money - If you are Warren Buffet and you do manage to get medical care without insurance be prepared to pay 2 to 4 times the price the service normally costs because without insurance you no longer qualify for the "negotiated" rates. Believe it or not when you go to the Doctor and your insurance pays nothing you still got a great deal because without the worthless-pay-nothing insurance your bill probably would have been 2 to 4 times higher. They should really just hand you the paperwork to file for bankruptcy rather than actually waste time trying to bill you for that crazy amount.

                If you don't like it leave because in politically correct, socialized America freedom is not only not free it is nonexistent.

                Perhaps the best part? By the time you figure your insurance out they will have changed you to a different company with an even cheesier (but more costly) plan!

                274/218/150
                Last edited by jfrendek; 09-29-2011, 07:48 AM.
                -Transform!

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                • #9
                  Groktimus Primal's - The New Messiah

                  Groktimus Primal's - The New Messiah

                  Not to give Mark a swelled head but he is definitely a bit of a savior. I have not seen such cohesion in bringing a like minded group together since Dr. Atkin's died. I consider myself to be somewhat enlightened considering the amount of my life I've dedicated to weight loss and health. Enlightened or not the Primal journey took some time for me to fully invest in. A friend showed me the MDA site and here are my initial thoughts and why I was mistaken...

                  I thought it was over the top taking a "diet" to an all encompassing way of life.
                  - The truth is that this is what I had been looking for all along but didn't realize it.

                  I thought the whole Grok thing was a bit gimmicky.
                  -Grok supplies useful analogies and is a fantastic symbol/mascot.

                  I thought he was selling ridiculously priced supplements.
                  -I examined the supplement ingredients and the prices are not that high for the list of comprehensive quality ingredients he supplies.

                  I thought he was mainly out to turn a buck.
                  -As he said there is nothing wrong with capitalism and he has to eat too.

                  I read Robb Wolf and Loren Cordain's books first because they seemed less hokey.
                  -Reading their books was a great idea but I find myself gravitating back to MDA for the daily wisdom and the community.

                  I am impressed that Mark seems to be brutally honest in his convictions.

                  274/219/150
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                  • #10
                    Groktimus Primal's - Self Stress and Rituals

                    Groktimus Primal's - Self Stress and Rituals

                    I'm not a Doctor nor am I attractive enough to play one on TV but I've always suspected that I had a touch of OCD. (obsessive compulsive disorder) I write most of it off to being a creature of habit and enjoying consistency in every possible way but I know it's likely a tad more than that. If you use your OCD or repetitive nature to build positive repeatable habits it can be constructive to some extent but I have found that one's entire day can be slowly pecked away at doing needles rituals such as visiting websites that ceased to offer interesting content many moon's ago or just plain no longer interest you because perhaps your interests have shifted.

                    What happens then is you create anxiety if you do not perform your rituals or are pressed for time until you step back and truly consider what you are doing and the lack of value in it. I like to stop and say "Is this activity worth my time and attention?" The Zynga games are a fantastic example of this for many. I can not stand them myself.

                    Exercise or counting steps might be positive rituals but I can tell you getting in the habit of eating an even number of the same item (i.e. two of everything or four...) is not healthy. I think rituals give us a false sense of control (as does eating/lifestyle changes sometimes). Humans have a basic need to be in control even though deep down we all know most of this is an illusion and we are but frail boats at sea waiting for our luck to run out.

                    274/217/150
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                    • #11
                      Groktimus Primal's - Idea Who's Time Has Come

                      Groktimus Primal's - Idea Who's Time Has Come

                      I've heard people say everything old is new again at some point and it couldn't be truer for the Primal diet. I've noticed that the most correct answers tend to be the simplest. When someone tries to sell you an overly processed and complex fancy solution it is usually just trappings to distract you and get you on board with something expensive and flashy. While there is substantial work in farming, companies essentially exploit natural resources for a profit. Due to the "value" they add by destroying the food they set themselves apart and create profit margins. Corporations have done an excellent job snowballing us into buying these byproducts of food.

                      I am presently reading Appetite for Profit. It is a wonderful book referenced by Mark which helped me spawn this topic. It is a very long read and I must say I do not entirely agree with the author. She is obviously pro-regulation and while I don't like the corporations in the driver's seat I would be equally uncomfortable with the government. Since it seems like a lose-lose situation I obviously do not hold the answer. Also the author is a vegan and while she tries hard not to be "a pushy vegan" she does come right out and say that she believes it to be the healthy way to eat. If someone as obviously brilliant as her doesn't understand what is healthy then what chance do we have if we let any government, corporation or individual tell us what is healthy? I listen to Mark but I am always the in my driver's seat and I know Mark would expect that.

                      I find it very difficult to believe anyone without an agenda would question our genetics and what our species developed on being the right way to go. Sure there are unanswered questions but I don't think even the most pig headed would say we developed without substantial meat in the diet. How can nature be wrong when we are a a product of it? Sure you can argue sustainable this, and sustainable that but we can not solve tomorrows problems without making sure we take care of today. So if meat or anything else is the problem fine, fix it, but I won't go along with it if my already overpriced food is going to be substantially more expensive or unavailable.

                      Strange how everything comes full circle. It makes one question some of the motives of why we ever left what was working in the first place. I haven't finished the book yet but I am not very hopeful in finding a real workable solution to our food problems in it.

                      274/218/150
                      Last edited by jfrendek; 10-04-2011, 06:27 AM.
                      -Transform!

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                      • #12
                        I feel the same way about Mark - it's hard to wrap your mind around how many people he's helped. I have to give him partial credit for helping me conquer severe cystic acne, hormonal imbalances, and also for helping me to really see the world around for what it really is. He teaches people to think critically and to ask questions, and that's pretty priceless. I felt the same way about the supplements and the books at first, but I quickly realized how much free information he provides. You don't need his book or his supplements to transform your life, and I think that's pretty cool.
                        Mama Foxglove's Primal Pregnancy Journal

                        "Leave your drugs in the chemist's pot, if you can heal your patient with food." - Hippocrates

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                        • #13
                          Primal Topic - Selling the Value

                          Primal Topic - Selling the Value

                          That's the title of a class they are having where I work.

                          When did life become a dirty shell game? I love money as much as anyone else but I don't sit around trying to stick it to the guy next to me all day.

                          Like Mark says take care of yourself so you can enjoy life (play). Everyone's heard the eat to live, not live to eat philosophy. To me this translates into make money to live, not live to make money. I think we have really lost sight of this in our consumer driven economy and oh boy Christmas is coming! (in October so it appears)

                          Somehow we crowned money king and now it rules us.

                          Sometimes I wonder what global greedy conspiracy helped foster that or if it truly is our base nature. Perhaps we will someday flip from the me..me..me... more...more...more... to a more enlightened evolved altruism. Even if we are still evolving in any meaningful way I'm not holding my breath. I'm not even sure that would be a survival strategy. I have struggled all my life to see the forest for the trees. In the land of the blind the one eyed man is king

                          In my last post I stated I was not willing to sacrifice today for a better tomorrow unless said sacrifice was clearly livable and worthwhile judged by my own standards. I suppose that's common sense and the question has always been where to draw the line. A friend once told me that doing the right thing is often easy but knowing what that is, is nearly impossible!

                          One of the more disturbing things seems to be the proportion of scams to reasonable offers. When I was younger there were actual ads that had value. Now everything is a $19.95 late night TV deal kind of worthless thing. It seems there is almost no room for an honest offer.

                          If someone tries to sell me one more thing I'm gonna.... * BOOM *

                          274/218/150
                          Last edited by jfrendek; 10-05-2011, 09:31 AM.
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                          • #14
                            Groktimus Primal's - The Worst Time to Shop

                            Groktimus Primal's - The Worst Time to Shop

                            Why that would be 7-Eleven!

                            I have read Mark's writing in which he referenced seeing the world through a "primal lens". Even though I have been off real junk food for many years I had the misfortune of visiting a 7-Eleven recently because my girlfriend loves big fountain drinks and her mom loves coffee. It had been so long since I set foot in one I was surprised by my own horrific reaction.

                            Let me explain...

                            While she was getting the drinks I amused and educated myself by browsing the store. I have been in that store and many convenience stores over the course of my life but it was almost like I had landed on an alien planet. Between what I had learned and how long I had "been clean" the place knocked my sensibilities senseless.

                            First I noticed all the unnaturally bright packaging attempting to lure in anyone who wasn't blinded by the spectacle. Next I noticed the pastries/donuts near the coffee island. It's like an episode of consumer "Survivor". Then I saw the "Neon Sugar Slush" known as Slurpee's and the enormous cup sizes. I then surveyed the vast array of chips, candies, soda, energy drinks (very prominent), nuts, jerky, power bars and the lifeless sandwiches containing small quantities of processed meat with very little vegetation and huge buns. Small amounts of basic fruit, yogurt and cheese were nearby. Want some trail mix? I hope you like M&M’s and/or Chex Mix grain based products with that.

                            Another scary element near the gum and candy filled register was the food bar where you can purchase hotdogs, cheeseburger dogs?!?, Nachos with Cheez Wiz and probably salmonella. Of course the tobacco and girlie mags are still available behind the counter. Not that I have a problem with the girlie mags

                            I took note that the very few items that might be eaten as a last resort were intentionally contaminated. Fruits are coated if not served in a sugar solution, meat is processed, power bars are high in sugar even if they claim to be low carb. I'm still trying to wrap my head around a cheeseburger dog rotating for hours on end like a typical hotdog. I didn’t think the immortal hotdogs were scary enough did you? I think if you were truly screwed and had no other real choice to grab something to eat and you weren’t in a position to just seize the opportunity to fast you would have to eat something like this…

                            Bottled water
                            Beef Jerky (always somewhat contaminated)
                            Cheese sticks
                            Apple / Orange (coated)
                            Maybe a salad if you were fortunate enough to find one that isn’t too sad (yeah that’ll happen)

                            Does Mark offer a Damage Control Formula for a diet that has been devastated? To add a little additional insult a store like that is terminally over priced to start with. The price of convenience is higher than ever! I guess we are just lucky that booze, gambling and prostitution are not available too. We could bring down mankind with a one-stop-shop. Gas might just be the most useful and sometimes more affordable thing they sell. The next time you set foot in one of these places do so consciously and have the same experience I did. Who would think there was so much to write about from a store I didn’t even make a purchase in. I guess my not making a purchase is somewhat the point!

                            Organic, free range, grass fed, rotating cheeseburger dog anyone?

                            3… 2… 1… Soapbox dismount complete!

                            274/218/150
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                            • #15
                              Groktimus Primal’s – The New Book

                              Groktimus Primal’s – The New Book

                              As all devote followers know Mark is coming out with a new book on October 18th called The Primal Blueprint 21-Day Total Body Transformation. Like most everything he writes I’m sure it will be fantastic and include enough new insights and colorful writing to make it worth reading even if you have practically memorized his other works. I will certainly buy it (in Kindle format) to both read and support Mark’s efforts.

                              As Mark said himself this book is likely to become a best seller and bring Primal eating into the limelight. This is good, not just good but great obviously so why am I bothering to write this? Well you see I have been here before. I had success with the Atkin’s diet and I managed a GNC and I saw all the products and the people succeeding. I also saw a lot of people who thought they were following the diet but weren’t and a lot of products that claimed to be compatible with the diet but really were just taking advantage of people.

                              I thought for a while that the truth would set you free and people would learn by seeing the high success rate and telling one another about it. Unfortunately, accept for the relatively few unbrainwashable people who quietly continued to enjoy a hard fought truth the conventional wisdom hammered away at it and Doctor Atkin’s passed away and the quick buck companies stopped smelling blood in the water and many of the products and services disappeared.

                              This will happen with the Primal diet as well for the following reasons… Conventional wisdom is so well funded. The corporations do not make money if they do not create processed food. Like most things of value, good food costs more than eating the cardboard box does, but eating the cardboard box does not make it food. Nutrition can be confusing, especially if confusion is the goal. Our government is bought and paid for. They will not tell you to stop eating anything that profits the industry even though it is the people and the farmers they should be worried about. If we do not have good food, water and air nothing else matters. Who worries about being late to work while having a heart attack?

                              I don’t enjoy sounding gloomy (well sometimes maybe) but it’s not all bad. There is still plenty of good that can be done via grassroots movements just don’t expect it to ever become the conventional wisdom. If it does then there is a good chance it may be wrong too! I enjoyed the Atkin’s heyday but I was depressed when society turned away from it and started shoving not just carbs but processed carbs back down everyone’s throats. You will find the people in-the-know will stick to it no matter what anyone may say but those folks that were just looking for a new “diet religion” to save them from “obesity hell” who have a half-assed approach will quickly cave. They might as well pick up some Frankenberry cereal now.

                              I must admit both with Primal and low carb knowledge it crossed my mind that perhaps I would rather the “secret” not get out. I know it’s selfish but as Mark said we are competing in the world and due to the laws of supply and demand suppose we found that what little edible food is left was no longer attainable except by the rich? Luckily or unluckily it seems most people have little conviction and almost ask to be lied to. I was a poor GNC salesperson because I could not tell people what they wanted to hear which was basically… “Yeah, just take these pills I have right here for $39.99 and the pounds will melt off!” When the truth is health/weight loss doesn’t come from a bottle and if it did I would have sold out at any price and the FDA would have shut me down the next week for selling something “dangerous” to the “dumb” general public.

                              Let’s end on a happy note, even though the truth will not set you free it is damn near impossible to completely kill. The opposition will always have to use suppression and distraction tactics because their arguments have little foundation. To me nature is the closest thing to a one true God and he/she/it cannot by definition be wrong.

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