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in the process of un-carbing but endurance is a challenge

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  • in the process of un-carbing but endurance is a challenge

    Hi all,

    I'd love to hear your opinion on the following: my husband is in the process of going primal, and has minimal carbs (bar an occasional treat here and there). Adaptation is going well, supported by IF (16/8), mostly for inflammation-reduction and longevity.
    He's been doing it for a few weeks now, but the last few days he experiences more fatigue, and sports (tennis) is tough without carbing up.
    I need to add that he started his primal experiment and IF at the same time.
    My question is: what do you think is the wisest thing for him to do here: back off the IF a bit, get fully fat-adapted first, then pick up IF again? Or tough it out?
    (Oh: does IF promote fat-adaptation this way?)


    Thanks!

  • #2
    Have him eat carbs with dinner, like a potato, sweet potato, or a serving of rice. It is not necessary to go very low carb.

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    • #3
      Why is he avoiding carbs?
      Sandra
      *My obligatory intro

      There are no cheat days. There are days when you eat primal and days you don't. As soon as you label a day a cheat day, you're on a diet. Don't be on a diet. ~~ Fernaldo

      DAINTY CAN KISS MY PRIMAL BACKSIDE. ~~ Crabcakes

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      • #4
        paleo/primal is not low carb

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        • #5
          Thanks for your feedback!
          The low carb is an experiment to reduce inflammation, and it fits more or less with primal (?).
          (Minimal carbs here = no bread or pasta, unless as a treat; oats and quinoa twice a week or so. Legumes like chickpeas: from time to time)

          Comment


          • #6
            Dumbellina,

            Oats and legumes are not exactly primal and they could cause inflammation.

            If your husband plays a lot of sports, he needs to replenish muscle glycogen by upping carbs. Sweet potato, yam, potato, rice, etc are all excellent sources. He can also take coconut water if a tennis game goes beyond 2 hours.

            Like other posters mentioned, Paleo/ Primal isn't exactly low-carb, although reducing carbs would help weight loss and ease chronic fatigue disease, insulin-resistance symptoms, etc. Our micronutrients requirement is all different, so your husband just has to keep experimenting until he finds the 'perfect formula'.

            Best,
            Joey

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Dumbellina View Post
              Thanks for your feedback!
              The low carb is an experiment to reduce inflammation, and it fits more or less with primal (?).
              (Minimal carbs here = no bread or pasta, unless as a treat; oats and quinoa twice a week or so. Legumes like chickpeas: from time to time)
              I think you're confusing the *word* carbohydrates with the *source* of carbohydrates. Wheat and cereal grains and legumes aren't bad because of their carb counts. They are bad because of their irritating and inflammatory anti-nutrients.

              There are carbohydrates in dairy, fruit, colorful and leafy vegetables, starchy vegetables, nuts, seeds, etc.... most of which are tolerated to some degree by most people. Your mileage my vary. An active person who isn't insulin resistant, diabetic, pre-diabetic, or attempting to lose fat has no reason to restrict carbohydrates. The key is to eat non-grain, non-legume (non-irritating) sources.
              Sandra
              *My obligatory intro

              There are no cheat days. There are days when you eat primal and days you don't. As soon as you label a day a cheat day, you're on a diet. Don't be on a diet. ~~ Fernaldo

              DAINTY CAN KISS MY PRIMAL BACKSIDE. ~~ Crabcakes

              Comment


              • #8
                Adapting to low carb for athletic endeavors could very well take him longer than just a few weeks. But, from what you have posted I wouldn't consider what your doing "low carb". So its likely he's just not eating enough.
                Last edited by Neckhammer; 04-26-2013, 04:52 PM.

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                • #9
                  Thank you all for your reactions.
                  Things are falling into place, but still in the process of experimenting & learning
                  Have a great week!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hello Dumbellina,

                    You should get the book "The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance" by Phinney and Volek so your husband (and you) know how to tackle "uncarbing" and still perform.

                    I can try to give you a few tips:

                    - while becoming "fat-adapted", don't work out too much
                    - low carb - high fat diets are not necessarily ketogenic diets and some people do not tolerate being in the "fuel limbo" if physical performance is paramount (the body does not get enough carbs but is not very efficient at fat burning ... can be a problem). If he wants to experiment, he will have to go fully ketogenic for a while. What about a variation of the "steak and eggs diet" (with a few leafy greens on the side to not make it too boring) with plenty of butter ? This is close to zero "net-carb" and will make him go fully ketogenic (if the amount of proteins is not too high, so he can skip egg whites once in a while).
                    - ketogenic diets make hunger "almost" a thing of the past, but you do have to eat if physical performance is important. The thing about being ketogenic is that glycogen is mostly spared and only used when really required. The brain will mostly run of ketones (with much less glucose than a non ketogenic one) and the muscles will burn free fatty acids when effort is not maxed out (60% VO2max).

                    Nutritional ketosis is a very special metabolic state and must be entered by a well tailored diet that will provide ALL needed nutrients (macro and micro). Read the book I recommend and follow the experts' advice.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by dkJames View Post
                      Hello Dumbellina,

                      You should get the book "The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance" by Phinney and Volek so your husband (and you) know how to tackle "uncarbing" and still perform.

                      I can try to give you a few tips:

                      - while becoming "fat-adapted", don't work out too much
                      - low carb - high fat diets are not necessarily ketogenic diets and some people do not tolerate being in the "fuel limbo" if physical performance is paramount (the body does not get enough carbs but is not very efficient at fat burning ... can be a problem). If he wants to experiment, he will have to go fully ketogenic for a while. What about a variation of the "steak and eggs diet" (with a few leafy greens on the side to not make it too boring) with plenty of butter ? This is close to zero "net-carb" and will make him go fully ketogenic (if the amount of proteins is not too high, so he can skip egg whites once in a while).
                      - ketogenic diets make hunger "almost" a thing of the past, but you do have to eat if physical performance is important. The thing about being ketogenic is that glycogen is mostly spared and only used when really required. The brain will mostly run of ketones (with much less glucose than a non ketogenic one) and the muscles will burn free fatty acids when effort is not maxed out (60% VO2max).

                      Nutritional ketosis is a very special metabolic state and must be entered by a well tailored diet that will provide ALL needed nutrients (macro and micro). Read the book I recommend and follow the experts' advice.
                      dkJames,

                      This is great advice, thank you! I've been on a primal/lower carb diet for 4 months with lots of veggies, eggs & protein helped along by CO & Butter. While I believe I am fat adapted (I do not have hunger pangs & I do 22 hour fasts 2 times a week) I still do 3/week a 2-3 mile jog with a few BW exercises thrown in to lose some pounds from a few parts.

                      Should I not aim for nutritional ketosis if I also look for good endurance performance? Thanks for your time!

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                      • #12
                        Hi dkJames,

                        Interesting! Thanks!

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                        • #13
                          Fat adapting is tough and it's easy to push it too far. I regularly push the distance that I go without any glycogen to try and force cellular metabolic adaptations. I eat carbs in the form of sweet potatoes and white rice when I want to have a faster run and to make sure that my body doesn't forget how to use glucose for fuel but I believe the important thing is to feed your body nutrient rich food so that it can metabolise whichever fuel you are using at the time. On Saturday I completed a trail marathon with 1300m of climb and I really relied on my fat metabolism to get me to the end. It was interesting and satisfying to go past quite a few athletes who had not adapted and had exhausted their energy. I was sure to have a heavy carb day before the race to make sure I had optimal glycogen levels. Metabolic flexibility is my goal, your husband's goals may be different.
                          Man seeks to change the foods available in nature to suit his tastes, thereby putting an end to the very essence of life contained in them.
                          www.primaljoy.co.uk

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                          • #14
                            There are some foods for healthy that can protect your from different serious health issues.


                            Health tips

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