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Question Re: Squats For Tall Mo'fos

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Nekron View Post
    The internet is so goddamn retarded when it comes to squats its not even funny anymore.

    When someone says that squats arent as useful for tall people its not at all about getting strong or not. Of course you can get a reasonably strong squat even with a suboptimal build for it. Its not about fear of injury either.

    Thing is, its a fucking back exercise for people with the wrong proportions which makes doing both squats and deadlifts completely pointless unless you are trying to become a powerlifter with an official record. Its not about pussying around because your back cant take it, its about getting shit done for your legs before your back is completely exhausted.
    Originally posted by Gorbag View Post
    While heavy back squats may be a good exercise for many strength trainees it sure does not follow that it is an optimal lower body exercise for EVERYBODY – by far so! My lower back is pretty strong but it will always be the weak link when squatting, no matter what I am doing. So people with disproportional anatomy for doing back squats may indeeed be much better off doing something else for their lower body. Saying that everybody simply MUST squat for lower body strength, no matter what, is dogmatic and beyond stupid, even when it comes from strength “gurus” like Rippetoe or others…
    I think you guys are missing the point here. everyone should squat. it is an essential motion for our anatomy. that doesn't mean you need to load the bar with maximum weight. it could mean sets of 10-12. it could mean bodyweight squats. it could mean grandma getting up and down from a chair. it doesn't mean you need to compete in a lifting meet. it is a motion that we should all be doing for health and mobility. if you want to strength train your lower body in other manners (leg press, extensions, etc) then go for it. but make sure to squat up and down throughout the day.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by not on the rug View Post
      I think you guys are missing the point here. everyone should squat. it is an essential motion for our anatomy. that doesn't mean you need to load the bar with maximum weight. it could mean sets of 10-12. it could mean bodyweight squats. it could mean grandma getting up and down from a chair. it doesn't mean you need to compete in a lifting meet. it is a motion that we should all be doing for health and mobility. if you want to strength train your lower body in other manners (leg press, extensions, etc) then go for it. but make sure to squat up and down throughout the day.
      Maybe you are missing the point Rug? Nobody, I think, denies that a squat is a natural movement and should be done for mobility! The issue though is loaded back squatting that goes close to failure for improving lower body strength, 5 or 15 reps, the impact on lower back will still be devastating and seriously affect the rest of your strength programming and recovery if you have the wrong anatomical build! And it will not tax your legs as good as other movements either, so it will simply not be optimal for all people doing it…
      "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

      - Schopenhauer

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Gorbag View Post
        My lower back is pretty strong but it will always be the weak link when squatting, no matter what I am doing. So people with disproportional anatomy for doing back squats may indeeed be much better off doing something else for their lower body.
        You can deadlift more than you can squat. The deadlift taxes your lower back far more than a squat. So, how can you deadlift a heavy weight, but not squat a lighter weight with even less lower back involvement?

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Gorbag View Post
          Maybe you are missing the point Rug? Nobody, I think, denies that a squat is a natural movement and should be done for mobility! The issue though is loaded back squatting that goes close to failure for improving lower body strength, 5 or 15 reps, the impact on lower back will still be devastating and seriously affect the rest of your strength programming and recovery if you have the wrong anatomical build! And it will not tax your legs as good as other movements either, so it will simply not be optimal for all people doing it…
          did you actually read what I wrote? like, all of it. you told me i'm missing the point, then agreed with what I wrote

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          • #20
            Originally posted by quikky View Post
            You can deadlift more than you can squat. The deadlift taxes your lower back far more than a squat. So, how can you deadlift a heavy weight, but not squat a lighter weight with even less lower back involvement?
            No, back squatting taxes lower back more for me, always been so. But I am very careful also with deadlifting, it’s a strong medicine that should be used very sparingly when you get stronger! Basically; exercises that seriously hammer lower back will affect all your training and hold back recovery…
            "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

            - Schopenhauer

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Gorbag View Post
              No, back squatting taxes lower back more for me, always been so. But I am very careful also with deadlifting, it’s a strong medicine that should be used very sparingly when you get stronger! Basically; exercises that seriously hammer lower back will affect all your training and hold back recovery…
              have you tried high bar back squatting? for me, high bar position always felt more comfortable and taxes my lower back way less.

              I agree with deadlifting and squatting being used sparingly. I don't know how anyone can do either more than once a week. I mean, I could squat or deadlift 2-3 times per week, but only if I did nothing but eat and sleep the rest of the time. the effort needed and the recovery periods are just too much

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              • #22
                Originally posted by not on the rug View Post
                have you tried high bar back squatting? for me, high bar position always felt more comfortable and taxes my lower back way less.

                I agree with deadlifting and squatting being used sparingly. I don't know how anyone can do either more than once a week. I mean, I could squat or deadlift 2-3 times per week, but only if I did nothing but eat and sleep the rest of the time. the effort needed and the recovery periods are just too much
                Yes, high bar, and I have been squatting on and off for many years, but if I really want to train my legs I do leg-press or hack-lifts with various stance! I am sure that I could squat 370 pound for reps but that would ruin the rest of my training for a couple of weeks…
                "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

                - Schopenhauer

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by not on the rug View Post
                  did you actually read what I wrote? like, all of it. you told me i'm missing the point, then agreed with what I wrote
                  Ta daa! You've been Gorbagged!

                  Nobody agrees as argumentatively as him. He's the king. Long live the king.
                  The Champagne of Beards

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Gorbag View Post
                    Yes, high bar, and I have been squatting on and off for many years, but if I really want to train my legs I do leg-press or hack-lifts with various stance! I am sure that I could squat 370 pound for reps but that would ruin the rest of my training for a couple of weeks…
                    do you do hack squats with a machine or with a bar? I used to do them occasionally with a bar. I would imagine that they would tax your lower back as well though

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by RichMahogany View Post
                      Ta daa! You've been Gorbagged!

                      Nobody agrees as argumentatively as him. He's the king. Long live the king.
                      I am so used to disagree with all the nonsense that comes from you guys that I sometimes can forget to turn off the autopilot when we agree…
                      "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

                      - Schopenhauer

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by not on the rug View Post
                        do you do hack squats with a machine or with a bar? I used to do them occasionally with a bar. I would imagine that they would tax your lower back as well though
                        My gym have a good hack-lift machine so I use that, but I do a bit more leg-press than machine hacks. Yep, hacklift with a bar can be an interesting exercise as well..
                        "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

                        - Schopenhauer

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by not on the rug View Post
                          I think you guys are missing the point here. everyone should squat. it is an essential motion for our anatomy. that doesn't mean you need to load the bar with maximum weight. it could mean sets of 10-12. it could mean bodyweight squats. it could mean grandma getting up and down from a chair. it doesn't mean you need to compete in a lifting meet. it is a motion that we should all be doing for health and mobility. if you want to strength train your lower body in other manners (leg press, extensions, etc) then go for it. but make sure to squat up and down throughout the day.
                          I like this post. If i do it at a light weight i will get more benefit than not doing it at all. Get some mobility in some of the joints that wouldnt otherwise get any.

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                          • #28
                            If you do squat as a mobility drill go ass to grass and try to sit in the hole for a short while…
                            "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

                            - Schopenhauer

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              My 2 cents - I'm 5'9" and my low back is highly involved when I squat. To the point where it was hindering weight progression. As a solution, I don't squat as deeply which tucks my tailbone under and reduces the natural lumbar curve. Keeping my back in this formation eases the pain and I can squat heavier and longer. Granted, it's still a work in progress, but the exercise doesn't bother me like it used to. Basically I go as low as I can before I need to tuck my tailbone to stay balanced. Somewhere past thighs parallel to the floor and my butt touching the floor.

                              FWIW.
                              5' 9" 47 YO F
                              PB start June 2, 2012
                              Pre PB SW = 180 (no scale at home, Mom's scale January - 153lbs!)
                              Current deadlift 245 lbs, squat 165 lbs, bench press 135 lbs


                              PB Journal

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                              • #30
                                lemme see you squat, squat, squat, squat
                                lemme see you squat, squa-squat, squat, squat

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