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Squats aren't as effective as we thought!

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  • #16
    Originally posted by granth View Post
    You clearly didnt understand the video. This is for training your glutes without loading your spine...
    Is that necessarily a good thing? If you use proper form and brace your spine correctly, isn't it ok for force to be transferred along your spine? Yeah, I know that you can do damage if you load it up incorrectly and use poor form, but I don't think that means you should avoid using your lumbar muscles/spinal erectors at all costs. Compound weight bearing movements have been in style for a looong time. Isolation movements are much newer and seem to mostly be used by bodybuilders.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Joshy View Post
      Furthermore, the exercise he recommends is simply contracting the glutes in isolation without any resistance. Assuming that because no other muscles are working very hard, this is the most effective exercise -- more effective than, say, a heavy deadlift, is ridiculous. That would be like saying "Okay, now push shoulder forward and down toward your nipple... now you've just contracted the chest!! Make sure not to do pushups or bench press, because then you'll be activating the triceps and the lats and the shoulders!! Do these shoulder crunches every day!"
      Very well said.

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      • #18
        And one more thing. Didn't Bret Contreras make the argument that squats and deads are not the best glute exercises like 3 years ago?

        T NATION | Dispelling the Glute Myth

        He doesn't recommend against squats and deads, he just recommends that anyone looking to strengthen/build their glutes include some of the exercises he lists and demonstrates in the article linked above.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by quikky View Post
          Consider this: the glutes' function is hip extension. How is it possible that a person can squat, which requires hip extension, without their glutes firing?

          It doesn't matter if you can't feel them firing, this is true of many muscles. This is not indicative of them not working.
          Because the hamstring and adductor groups also have hip extension functions it probably is possible.

          Does it happen in non-pathological cases? I doubt it but I don't know.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
            Umm. no?

            But seriously, my glutes dont fire readily, and I dont feel them firing when I squat. I cant go down to full squat yet though, so that's probably why.
            I think what you feel in the lunges is more the extra stretch than extra firing.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by OldSchhool View Post

              With regards to the stimulation graphs I'm pretty positive that one would show higher stimulation to the quads when doing leg extensions than it would when doing squats.......does this mean you should drop squats in favor of leg extensions ?

              Same would be likely comparing deltoid activation during lateral raises compared with over head presses.
              Yeah, it is physiological fact that muscles activate most fully when there is maximum resistance in the fully contracted position.
              Nautilus rotary machines and some bodybuilding methods have tried to integrate this.
              Seems logical that exercises that provide that resistance would be best for growth.
              For whatever reason reality doesn't seem to follow that logic.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by bcbcbc2 View Post
                Because the hamstring and adductor groups also have hip extension functions it probably is possible.
                This doesn't jive with my limited understanding of the complex machine known as the human body. Unless you're talking about some kind of butt-amputees. In which case, I claim even less understanding of the relevant physiology.
                The Champagne of Beards

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                • #23
                  Using a computer in the gym = fail.

                  Just pick up a barbell and squat some freakin' weight.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by bcbcbc2 View Post
                    I think what you feel in the lunges is more the extra stretch than extra firing.
                    And that might just be a great point for the squat and lunge, Steve Holman who writes for Ironman magazine incorporates emphasized stretch positions under load in his methods as studies indicate that it results in huge growth triggers.

                    A Forgotten Get-Bigger Trigger | Steve Holman

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                    • #25
                      Activating glutes during a squat is all technique and ques. Tight back, chest up, keep knees spread throughout, keep spine locked and dont allow the tailbone to tuck under. Once at the bottom, you should feel like a loaded rubberband. Dont pause and just explode up, at the top, contract glutes and force hips through. You do that and theres no way your ass wont grow.

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                      • #26
                        Anyone have any thoughts on this video, I was watching a couple of Mark Rippetoes and then came across this.

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                        • #27
                          Rippetoe is the leader of a religious cult OldSchool, arguments of reason is like throwing water on a goose, it’s pretty much a waste of time! Anyway, the Rippetoe religion is all about lifting MOAR, not about finding the most optimal way of becoming stronger, and the main bulk of the cult members will never discover the difference...

                          Here another guy that is not very happy with the results of squatting low bar Rippetoe style:

                          Last edited by Gorbag; 11-10-2013, 11:15 AM.
                          "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

                          - Schopenhauer

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Gorbag View Post
                            Rippetoe is the leader of a religious cult OldSchool, arguments of reason is like throwing water on a goose, itís pretty much a waste of time! Anyway, the Rippetoe religion is all about lifting MOAR, not about finding the most optimal way of becoming stronger, and the main bulk of the cult members will never discover the difference...

                            Here another guy that is not very happy with the results of squatting low bar Rippetoe style:
                            Gorbag, do you honestly have nothing better to do than shit on Rippetoe every chance you get? I mean seriously, no one is even talking about him or his program, and here you are again, for the umpteenth time, trying to revive the same tired BS that's been argued ad nauseam before. Everyone here knows you have a hard-on for Rippetoe. That's fine. Can we just move on now?

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by OldSchhool View Post
                              Anyone have any thoughts on this video, I was watching a couple of Mark Rippetoes and then came across this.
                              This guy makes perfectly valid points. However, he is not arguing against proper low-bar form as is described in the SS book. The Rippetoe video he talks about is about getting someone to utilize hip drive, not a perfect example of a low-bar squat. Rippetoe's squat form involves chest and hips coming up at the same time. Your knees don't extend first, your ass does not shoot back, you do not do a good morning squat - these are all form problems.

                              Hip drive is about keeping the back at the proper, more horizontal (compared to high bar) angle, and utilizing the posterior chain as the primary driver of the squat, not the knees/quads. That is all it is. When Rippetoe says "ass up" it is not a cue for doing a good morning squat, driving the ass back, or any such nonsense, it is simply a cue to get someone to think of their hips as the driver, not their knees. It is also used to keep the knees in place, and not shooting forward, which decreases hamstring involvement and causes a more vertical back angle during the beginning of the ascent.

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                              • #30
                                I don't understand why anyone takes rip as an expert in anything, and ss is one of the worst programs available. I guess he caters to the weak bros who just stopped doing bench and curls day everyday.

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