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  • #16
    Originally posted by Lockstock View Post
    How so? is it because of less volume?

    If I were to drop to 3x5, I'm practically doing SS minus the power cleans and instead rows. So, isn't that a good thing right?
    No, because you don't start with the empty bar. But you've already started, so I think this is just a point of confusion.

    It's a better thing if you can learn to do the power clean. Because it helps drive all the other lifts up by being explosive. (recruits more muscle fibers blah blah).
    The Champagne of Beards

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    • #17
      Originally posted by RichMahogany View Post
      No, because you don't start with the empty bar. But you've already started, so I think this is just a point of confusion.

      It's a better thing if you can learn to do the power clean. Because it helps drive all the other lifts up by being explosive. (recruits more muscle fibers blah blah).
      Ehh, I don't really care for learning it. I'm not saying your wrong, but, I'm happy with the program as is, and I'm making awesome strength gains in a short period of time.

      I was just wondering if I should change the program to something like 3x5, because SL seems to cop a lot of shit for being a bad/ripped off/high volume/bad program and I wasn't sure why.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Lockstock View Post
        Ehh, I don't really care for learning it. I'm not saying your wrong, but, I'm happy with the program as is, and I'm making awesome strength gains in a short period of time.

        I was just wondering if I should change the program to something like 3x5, because SL seems to cop a lot of shit for being a bad/ripped off/high volume/bad program and I wasn't sure why.
        You're way better off skipping power cleans and doing the rest of the lifts than not doing the rest of the lifts. I'm not saying it's crucial. If you're making progress with what you're doing, stick with it. Maybe think about adding some different dynamic work once you're done with your novice phase (maybe speed squats?).
        The Champagne of Beards

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        • #19
          Originally posted by RichMahogany View Post
          You're way better off skipping power cleans and doing the rest of the lifts than not doing the rest of the lifts. I'm not saying it's crucial. If you're making progress with what you're doing, stick with it. Maybe think about adding some different dynamic work once you're done with your novice phase (maybe speed squats?).
          I am! just that im not sure if gains would be better served by me doung 3x5 as opposed to the normal 5x5 in SL. This is all based purely on gaining strength. When im done milking my novice gains I plan on changing things up, but i want a strength base first. Would that be best served by a 3x5 or a 5x5 approch?
          Im leaning towards 3, what do you think?

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Lockstock View Post
            I am! just that im not sure if gains would be better served by me doung 3x5 as opposed to the normal 5x5 in SL. This is all based purely on gaining strength. When im done milking my novice gains I plan on changing things up, but i want a strength base first. Would that be best served by a 3x5 or a 5x5 approch?
            Im leaning towards 3, what do you think?
            I already voted for 3 x 5 in this thread and your other thread.
            The Champagne of Beards

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            • #21
              That you did, point taken

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Lockstock View Post
                How so? is it because of less volume?

                If I were to drop to 3x5, I'm practically doing SS minus the power cleans and instead rows. So, isn't that a good thing right?
                Yes. 15 reps vs 25. You'll move heavier weight sooner, and you're probably less likely to stall early. And I think you're cheating yourself by not leaning power cleans. They were a game changer for me.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by H2ODawgs View Post
                  Yes. 15 reps vs 25. You'll move heavier weight sooner, and you're probably less likely to stall early. And I think you're cheating yourself by not leaning power cleans. They were a game changer for me.
                  I like rows for the fact that they have, and are correcting shoulder imbalances for me between the push and pulls.
                  Power cleans are probably really great, but for me personally, most likely not ideal at this time

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                  • #24
                    Are power cleans and number of sets the only differences between SS & SL? I've decided to go with SL but I'm wondering if, as a woman, I should start with 3x5 sets or do the program 5x5 like it says?

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Geeknik View Post
                      Are power cleans and number of sets the only differences between SS & SL? I've decided to go with SL but I'm wondering if, as a woman, I should start with 3x5 sets or do the program 5x5 like it says?
                      someone will come in and give you a better anwser soon no doubt, but fundementally there similar in tht your gaining strength through linear progression for nooobz.
                      The difference is in the details. SS has power cleans but ive heard many people switch to rows anyway.
                      Ofcourse youll notice that SL is 5x5 while SS is 3x5. SL has you start from an empty bar. SS has you start at a higher weight relative to each individuel.
                      From what ive been told and what i noticed today is that 3x5 is easier. Easier in a good way in that you gain strength with less volume, less exhaustion and therefor you wont stall as quickly.

                      So i say do 3x5.

                      As for power cleans, there technically more difficult to learn, but are highly reccomended. Personally I dont do it. I do SLifts progression and exercises in 3x5 instead of 5x5.

                      Both are good because youll get stronger. So take this information and make your own decision
                      hope this helped.

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                      • #26
                        I started out with SL5x5 but moved into the SS 3x5 style instead. I found faster gains through starting strength. Plus there really is no substitute for powercleans. They are such an amazing whole body work out, and the only time I've had mad DOMS in my traps was from doing them. There's nothing to lose to try out SS for 6 weeks and see how you progress. Don't forget to eat enough!

                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNPvRRXlVck

                        If you are looking for an okay guide on powercleans. Rippetoes guides are up on youtube too, but I was always having issue with my catch as I was always catching with my wrists. Now at least I'm catching on my shoulders/chest but I'm getting some gnarly bruises up on my delts which doesn't worry me that much, since im not bruising the shit outta my collarbones which is significantly worse.

                        ps if you cant see the youtube link its elliots guide called "how to power clean for bigger traps"
                        Last edited by sunsis; 06-03-2013, 02:54 AM.

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                        • #27
                          I watched the power clean vid and I think I'd rather do barbell rows instead. I have very weak wrists and it looks like I'd injure them with the way the bar has to be lifted up onto the shoulders with wrists bent back.? Also, since there's a bit of a squatting motion in power cleans wouldn't it be a bit much to do both power cleans and squats on the same day? Or how are the SS workouts divided?
                          For SL it is Squats, Bench Press and Barbell Rows for Workout A and Workout B is Squats, Overhead Press and Deadlifts.

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                          • #28
                            Personally, I feel there aint enough back work if you don't do Rows. My preference.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Geeknik View Post
                              I watched the power clean vid and I think I'd rather do barbell rows instead. I have very weak wrists and it looks like I'd injure them with the way the bar has to be lifted up onto the shoulders with wrists bent back.? Also, since there's a bit of a squatting motion in power cleans wouldn't it be a bit much to do both power cleans and squats on the same day? Or how are the SS workouts divided?
                              For SL it is Squats, Bench Press and Barbell Rows for Workout A and Workout B is Squats, Overhead Press and Deadlifts.
                              You catch the power clean on your deltoids. Your hands will open and depending on your flexibility, some of your fingers may lose contact with the bar entirely to achieve the rack position. This does take some practice and coaching for most people to achieve, but there should not be much stress on the wrists.

                              You will be power cleaning significantly less weight than you work with on the squat, and if you're truly "power" cleaning, there's not much front squat motion. It shouldn't really interfere with squatting. The hard part is the jump. When the bar reaches mid-thigh and you extend your entire body explosively to produce upward momentum on the bar.

                              SS workouts change throughout your progression through the novice stages. I think the best, concise breakdown is on blackironbeast.com, but you should buy the book, even if you don't plan on using the program, if only to get a better understanding of the methodology behind the lifts and the correct technique to get the most out of them.
                              The Champagne of Beards

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                              • #30
                                Just out of curiosity, would squat thrusters work the same muscles as the clean and jerk or be even better to do than the power clean?
                                Last edited by Geeknik; 06-06-2013, 06:10 PM.

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