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You can use fat for high intensity exercise?

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  • You can use fat for high intensity exercise?

    Hey guys, i was under the impression we needed glycogen for high intensity exercise (eg. Weights and sprinting). But i just watched this video, where Dr Greg Ellis explains given enough time our bodies adapt and that fat can power muscle contractions.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpUu8Wdi3_U

    Does anybody have any thoughts on this? would my muscles be able to use fat for sprints and weightlifting now that i am fat adapted?
    Last edited by Lukey; 08-20-2012, 04:44 AM.

  • #2
    i can say that, i have been in Ketosis for some weeks now and follow ADF. i do intense weight training upon completion of a 30-36 hour fast and do not struggle in the slightest. There is no way i am not being fuelled from Fat.

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    • #3
      thats good to hear , my only worry is that if i drop my carbs completely and train intense i will be burning my muscles for fuel as i have no glycogen (which is what everybody on the internet seems to think happens)

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      • #4
        Ketones are key to saving muscle, you should find out you strength in a hand full of given strength determining exercises (i can help you pick these if needs be) then you should follow marks advice about marathon cardio - Less reps, Focus on Strength and ensure things are moving in the right direction. if you are getting continually weaker you are doing something drastically wrong this is over the course of a month rather than on a work out by work out basis as you will have good days and bad and initially whilst you adjust you will lose some strength.

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        • #5
          I am already fat adapted, i just wanted to hear other peoples thoughts and experiences doing high intensity excercieses with no glycogen. Have you realised your muscles getting smaller through glycogen depletion?

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          • #6
            no i have not experienced my muscles getting smaller, my indicator measurements are around the same as they have been for quite a long time.

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            • #7
              ok thanks, anyone else feel free to post your thoughts on this

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              • #8
                When you are keto-adapted, your glycogen stores are approximately at 50%. It's not like you are completely glycogen depleted.

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                • #9
                  so they will never fall below 50% no matter how hard i train?

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Lukey View Post
                    so they will never fall below 50% no matter how hard i train?
                    This is from Colette Heimowitz, Atkins nutritionist. I hope I'm not violating any TOS by posting it here.

                    You can fat load instead of carb load to meet energy needs. If you have been under 50 grams of carbs for a year, you are already keto adapted and you will be fine with adequate sodium and fat and protein. You can get plenty of carbs from vegetables, some nuts/seeds and their butters, greek yogurt, and low glycemic fruits. That is all you need. Take coconut milk with you and a no sugar added electrolyte drink to refuel.

                    If you do this you can avoid the 'bonk' because you will already be in fat burning mode. You will also not experienec the GI distress some athletes suffer with when they can't even keep water.

                    The body is equipped to use two sources of energy; carbohydrate and fat. When carbs are low the body will switch to fat burning.

                    Even though a ketogenic diet (Induction) involves consuming very little carbohydrate, the body still stores carbohydrate in the form of glycogen in muscles. On a ketogenic diet, muscle glycogen stores are about one half normal levels. The muscles will deplete muscle glycogen quicker on a ketogenic diet, but this will only become an issue if you are performing high repetition and high set workouts that tax your glycogen stores. Whether or not you should consume a little carbohydrate to enhance your workout in the form of berries, nuts, greek yogurt is unknown because this is highly individual. You must experiment in training. I would guess that it would help if a little more low glycemic carbs are consumed along with protein and this might help your performance. But the more carbs you consume, the more likely you will throw yourself out of fat burning.

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                    • #11
                      thanks for the post, but i think that is aimed more at endurance athletes more than weightlifters and sprinters

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                      • #12
                        I would recommend checking out some videos from Dr.Greg Ellis. He can help you understand how to use fat for fuel in your muscles.
                        Fuel for Muscle Contrations gone over by Dr. Gregory Ellis - YouTube
                        Paleo since November 2011 - Carnivore since June 2012
                        Before and after pics
                        http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread65846.html
                        Primal Sucess Story
                        http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread65400.html
                        Primal Journal
                        http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum...tml#post955444

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                        • #13
                          Yea i have watched greg ellis's videos thats why i posted this. I was wondering if i am adapted enough to fuel high intensity excercise with fat if i have been paleo for 3 months.

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                          • #14
                            Lukey, I haven't been VLC for over a year now, but I did it for about 4 straight months during spring 2011. During that time I worked out very intensely, doing heavy compound lifts to failure. My strength improved over the entire period, which I suppose means I gained muscle as well, though it wasn't super noticeable.

                            I've never been entirely sold on the VLC thing, which is why I eventually moved back into eating carbs, but I will say I performed perfectly fine on it during intense activity (the type of stuff generally referred to as glycolytic).

                            Oh, and for what it's worth, currently I eat about 150-200g of carbs a day, and feel/perform just as well, with the added benefit that I have more food options.

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                            • #15
                              thanks thats what i wanted to hear, I might start training fasted now and stop worrying about have a pre-workout meal with carbs etc. thanks for the reply

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