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    is running 20 miles ok? I really enjoy running and love to do trail runs with my running group on the weekends. The shortest distance on sunday is usually 10 miles, so I have to get some short runs in during the week equaling another 10 miles.

    My concern is that I read alot of posts on here stating X is too much- Y is way over board etc.


    Any suggestions?


    Eating? I don't really keep track, but I eat 2x- 3x's a day, my carbs are somewhere in the neighborhood of under 30-40 grams/ daily and my protein/ fat ration is probably 70/30 respectively. I tried eating more fat but it just did not work for me.


    anyway- any suggestions?


  • #2
    1



    If you really want to run then I recommend varying your pace along the way -- everything from walking to all-out sprinting. If your running mates aren't keen on that, let them do what they want and when you fall behind, make that an opportunity to sprint and overtake them.

    You lousy kids! Get off my savannah!

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    • #3
      1



      if you are saying your total carb grams for the day are 30-40grams and you can do 20 miles per week on that, i'm amazed. I struggle to do 3-5 miles per day on average 80 grams of carbs per day. i could not run those distances on 30-40 daily g.


      it doesn't sound like too much to me. trail runs tend to ebb & flow in speed anyway because of the terrain and otherwise you are just doing 2or3 3-5 mile runs per week which is no big deal to me. i do that and consider myself within primal guidelines.

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      • #4
        1



        Lolly, I was being very liberal with the carbs. Some days I get none or close to zero (under 10) and run fine upwards of 7.5 miles. My plan is to run a marathon this November on very low carb. Fat is a much better fuel for distance running. Once you get your body in a ketogenic state you have an (almost) unlimited supply of fuel. Another benefit is that since I am not burning glucose thus creating pyruvate, I do not get that lactic acid burn. My running speeds and distances have increased as a result.

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        • #5
          1



          Loly: I bike daily about 25 miles (spending about 1400 calories) in the process, and I eat under 50 grams of carbs. It just takes to switch from fast acting carbs to fat.

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          • #6
            1



            heck yeah. Ever read born to run? I kind of disagree with Mark that humans didn't run long distances. I think humans really truly are born to run. We are the running kings/queens of this planet. We can outrun any other animal on earth! I love to run and as long as you don't go really fast (ie: burn fat) you should be fine eating a primal diet. In fact, like you said, a primal diet low in carbs helps to sustain the long runs.


            Keep it up fellow runner

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            • #7
              1

              [quote]

              We can outrun any other animal on earth
              </blockquote>


              What a load of rubbish. Humans are terrible runners compared most animals.


              The whole idea of persistence hunting is a joke.

              The "Seven Deadly Sins"

              Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
              Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
              Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

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              • #8
                1



                "Born to Run?"


                Antelope, horses, gazelles, buffalo, yes.


                Humans, out of necessity.


                Or insanity.

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                • #9
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                  "Top ten reasons to not run marathons."


                  http://www.arthurdevany.com/articles/20091028

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                  • #10
                    1



                    If you love it then do it.

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                    • #11
                      1



                      Humans are most efficient when walking; we are some of the most efficient walkers on the planet.


                      Humans are second most efficient when sprinting.


                      Humans are third most efficient when doing a slow loping jog.

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                      • #12
                        1



                        is running 20 miles ok? I really enjoy running and love to do trail runs with my running group on the weekends.
                        Might be, might not be. Only way to know if it&#39;s o.k. for you is to try it and see how you respond. Jonas Colting does well with his (admittedly not 100% by the book) Primal training and racing, but he may be a genetic outlier who&#39;d do well almost without regard to his diet and/or training. Still, he&#39;s got a system that works for him. Note though that he&#39;s able to run in the "move slowly" intensity zone. If you&#39;re running 10 miles above that zone you may want to scale back the amount of long running you do. In the book Mark writes that occasional long fast running is likely not a problem, but it&#39;s not something he&#39;d recommend doing weekly or even every other week. Still, it&#39;s up to you to see whether you can make it work in the context of your Primal life.


                        so I have to get some short runs in during the week equaling another 10 miles.
                        Why? Some ultrarunners do limited running during the week and rely on a weekly long run to get them through races - even 100s. I&#39;m not saying ultrarunning is Primal, just that it can be done with less week mileage than you might think. If you really "need" the mileage for the longer runs, try to stay in that "move slowly" zone.


                        OtB - thanks for the link to Art Devany&#39;s list. You and I have gone back and forth on marathoning before, and I think you know that I&#39;m no longer a big fan of it. So while I&#39;ll admit that DeVany raises some good points - many of which caused me to re-consider my own marathoning - his top 2 reasons are a joke.


                        At least four participants of the Boston Marathon have died of brain cancer in the past 10 years.

                        Art, get real. Since 2000, there have been approximately 162,000 official Boston finishers and thousands more in the years before that. 4 brain cancer deaths out of all Boston finishers is likely below the national average (even assuming a high rate of "recidivism" for repeat Boston offenders), and we don&#39;t know how many of those deaths were from cases diagnosed before the race. Weak.


                        The first marathon runner, Phidippides, collapsed and died at the finish of his race.

                        DeVany dresses this one up with a fancy journal citation, but I believe the earliest known written account of a run from Marathon to Athens is actually from about 500 years after the battle - and that one doesn&#39;t even attribute it to Pheidippides. Herodotus doesn&#39;t mention a post battle run in his more contemporaneous account of the battle. He only relates the story of Pheidippides&#39; run from Athens to Sparta and back in 2 days. In that context the whole story of Pheidippides making the run from the battlefield to the city and then dropping dead strikes me as about as credible as the story of young George Washington and the cherry tree.


                        That said, DeVany&#39;s other points are very well taken and worth considering. My only other comment on his post is that I&#39;d be inclined to add Clarence Bass to the list of "well known gurus who advocate weight lifting and may well outlive us all." (Yes, I know Bass eats a lot of carbs and advocates intense aerobics along with lifting - other example of a guy who&#39;s found a system that works for him.)

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                        • #13
                          1



                          @robmedina, I think if you want to run, you should run. I did the Boston marathon two years ago and had a total blast. And yes, I was low-carbing it at the time (not gonna lie though, chocolate & peanut butter were my favorite running snacks). Some folks really like running and there&#39;s no reason to stop. People who focus on chronic cardio as a way to lose weight, however, should really look at sprinting.

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                          • #14
                            1



                            Geoff, I was hoping you&#39;d weigh in here. You have a very realistic perspective based on lots of experience. I don&#39;t see us really going back and forth. I see a lot of common ground, actually.


                            My issue, and this happens often with a lot of topics, isn&#39;t whether someone wants to run their fool heart out or not. I&#39;m not that dogmatic nor want to control people, get them to see my way is the only way. It&#39;s the defense of "Grok was most definitely a long distance runner" as justification for running. To coin a phrase, "Just do it," if that&#39;s what you want to do.


                            I wonder if the brain cancer of the Boston Marathoners wasn&#39;t in winners. The reason I say that is it seems odd that anyone would find out about brain cancer in people who ran but were not a winner.

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                            • #15
                              1



                              20mpw is too much for me but i keep my carbs at 50g or below most times. i run 5-12mpw depending on energy levels, what my work load is like etc. it breaks down to me running 2-3x weekly and i feel like that&#39;s plenty for me!

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