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  • cardio

    do you need cardio for weight loss? or is LHT enough? i actually enjoy running (ie slow jog lol) on the treadmill but not sure if its doing any good, thank you

  • #2
    Eh, I think the forum is divided on this... personally, I can't think of anything more miserable than spending time on a treadmill.

    If you're lifting real heavy, the kind where you are actually close to being out of breath after you put the weight down, you may not need any extras.

    I've been told some of the traditional old 'cardio' is good as a follow-up to some HIIT activities, like if you hit the hill for some sprints some people say doing a short-ish jog after that helps as the initial HIIT session releases fatty acids that you can then 'burn' with your slow job. I have no idea if any of that is true.

    You say you enjoy it though, so research it some, but better yet: experiment. Take some measurements and spend a month doing something one way, then see how it went for you and try something else. I think we want to be pick the perfect combination of things, but don't spend enough time finding out what things our actual bodies respond best to.

    For instance. I'd like to sprint weekly right, but I don't do it, mostly because I have this stupid idea that if I don't sprint first thing in the morning then sprinting any other time is a waste of time. This is pretty wrong, sprinting at any hour is better than not doing it ever, but I was letting perfect be the enemy of good which ironically resulted in no activity at all. Another way to say this is, somebody who sprints in the afternoon is doing better than someone who never sprints, but the person sprinting first thing in the am is maybe doing a little better than the one that sprints in the afternoon... I hope that helps and isn't confusing.
    I used to seriously post here, now I prefer to troll.

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    • #3
      lol thank you not confusing at all i'm hoping to get a body fat measurement done today so will start there and get it done again in a month or so see how we go, being plateau'd sux!

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      • #4
        I love cardio but I honestly no longer believe it is any good for anything other than getting out for some sunshine and perhaps, if you enjoy it, fun. I've been doing floor body-weight-type exercises twice a week and finding it helps me with my main fun activity--hiking--way more than cardio every day ever did.
        Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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        • #5
          I have a short cardio time before I hit the weights. I personally feel like it helps crank my metabolism. It certainly helps get me "In the zone"
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          We get one shot at life, let's make it amazing

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Dragonfly32 View Post
            do you need cardio for weight loss? or is LHT enough? i actually enjoy running (ie slow jog lol) on the treadmill but not sure if its doing any good, thank you
            If you don't like cardio then other than (perhaps) as a warm up/cool down tool before and after doing Sprints and LHT workouts don't do cardio.

            There's very little that suggests to me that you're going to accomplish much FAT LOSS (forget about weight loss, you want to lose FAT, not muscle and often times the weight loss that people see doing a bunch of cardio is lost muscle tissue)

            After playing around with stuff and doing a little self-experimentation, I'm pretty convinced that you'd be better off taking that time you would put into cardio and either get more sleep or just do some low level walking. Either of those will go further to FAT loss than cardio -- the sleep because it will help normalize your hormones and limit the build up of Cortisol which will allow your body to reach a fat burning state and the walking because "low level" activity that stays in the 55-75% MHR is aerobic and will allow your body to naturally burn fat. Too much "cardio" in the 75-85% MHR range is anaerobic and won't burn fat, it will burn glycogen and will start to put your body in a hormonal state where it will catabolize muscle.

            Now, if you're like me and actually enjoy getting out and running, I don't see a reason why you can't incorporate it into the PBF plan. Like me right now, I'm training to run a half marathon in April. I now do ALL of my runs at a slow enough pace that I stay in that low-level 55-75% MHR range. I also don't run nearly as much mileage as I used to. I sprint 1X a week and LHT 2X a week as well. After my longest runs, I try to eat some Primal friendly carbs in order to keep my glycogen stores topped off and try to preserve my muscle mass.

            I realize that while I'm doing this, I'm probably not going to see much FAT loss since I'm not really putting my body in position to do that. That's ok, though as I like running and doing the occasional race. Once it's over in April, if I'm so inclined I might follow a regimen that will allow fat loss by doing more walking with the occasional (low level) run just to keep the rust off. I'll still keep Sprinting 1X a week and LHT 2X a week.
            Last edited by tim_1522; 02-13-2012, 01:54 PM.
            Re-focusing on the Primal Lifestyle in 2012!

            Starting: 221.0lb, 29.5% BF (1/9/2012)
            Latest: 208.9, 26.1% BF (3/19/2012)

            http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread35679.html

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            • #7
              No, you need a caloric deficit to lose weight. Performing cardiovascular exercise can help create a caloric deficit. Use it as you see fit
              "The problem with quoting someone on the Internet is, you never know if it's legit" - Abraham Lincoln

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              • #8
                Running is an inefficient means of weight loss

                Originally posted by Fernaldo View Post
                No, you need a caloric deficit to lose weight. Performing cardiovascular exercise can help create a caloric deficit. Use it as you see fit
                The net calorie burn (calories burned from exercise - resting metabolic rate) of running a mile is about 105 calories in a 9:30 mile according to this.

                And there are about 3500 calories in a pound of bodyfat.

                In order to burn 1lb of body fat from running, one would need to run 33 miles.

                If you enjoy running, by all means do so. But don't do it for weight loss. Have you tried intermittent fasting? I've lost close to 30lbs in the last 6 weeks doing primal/IF.

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                • #9
                  I am a believer in low level aerobic in the 55-75% range lower and slower is actually better for me. I enjoy walks and hikes when the weather is miserable the treadmill is a nice substitute. I can reach my goals easily for moving around alot at a slow pace by simpoly hitting a treadmill or a walk or a bike ride for 30 minutes a day every day. This is in addition to LHT and sprinting.

                  Just do what you are comfortable with but i think that the walking is important part of managing your blood lipids(stimulates HDL production) and habitualizing your body to burn fat.
                  Integrity is what we do when nobody's watching.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by ryantreb View Post
                    The net calorie burn (calories burned from exercise - resting metabolic rate) of running a mile is about 105 calories in a 9:30 mile according to this.

                    And there are about 3500 calories in a pound of bodyfat.

                    In order to burn 1lb of body fat from running, one would need to run 33 miles.

                    If you enjoy running, by all means do so. But don't do it for weight loss. Have you tried intermittent fasting? I've lost close to 30lbs in the last 6 weeks doing primal/IF.
                    Or you could do a HIIT workout twice a week and burn 2000 calories. "To lose weight" is a pretty vague statement. It all depends on current condition/state of the person. I use cardio (very minimal) to help with fat burning on leangains. I wouldn't recommend cardio for the sole purpose of weight loss, but it does have it's place when your diet is dialed in. For most people they feel better after doing it and feeling good goes a long way when trying to lose weight.
                    "The problem with quoting someone on the Internet is, you never know if it's legit" - Abraham Lincoln

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by ryantreb View Post
                      The net calorie burn (calories burned from exercise - resting metabolic rate) of running a mile is about 105 calories in a 9:30 mile according to this.

                      And there are about 3500 calories in a pound of bodyfat.

                      In order to burn 1lb of body fat from running, one would need to run 33 miles.

                      If you enjoy running, by all means do so. But don't do it for weight loss. Have you tried intermittent fasting? I've lost close to 30lbs in the last 6 weeks doing primal/IF.
                      Agreed...and that STILL doesn't even take into account what KIND of weight you are losing.

                      MOST people that do cardio "for the health benefits" do it too hard...and then push themselves to go further and go faster to keep that "calorie counter" spinning. The result is they push into the anaerobic zone. Your body can not efficiently burn fat in an anaerobic state. Glycogen is burned instead. After your cardio, you have 2 choices: 1) Carb up to replenish glycogen, which runs the risk of "spilling" and raising your blood sugar and raising insulin promoting fat storage. 2) Either don't carb up (OR be very careful to not "spill" and thereby not refilling your glycogen stores.

                      Keep doing this day after day and (following path 1) continually spike your insulin and keep your body in fat storage = FAT GAIN or (following path 2) continually have your glycogen levels depleted = FEEL LIKE CRAP which leads to increased Cortisol(promotes fat storage), eventually you quit from hitting the wall, or if you "push through" your body eventually starts to go after it's muscle = FAT GAIN plus MUSCLE LOSS. Now, if you're losing muscle faster than you are gaining fat, you might see a drop at the scale...but it's not the kind of loss you want to be fit, healthy, and primal.

                      I say this as someone who lived it without understanding the science behind it. After finding PB and gaining a better understanding -- it hit me me like "DUH!" That's why I felt like crap, made no progress, and was weak all the time!

                      If you REALLY want to do Cardio for FAT loss (not just weight loss) then SLOW DOWN. Take your pulse, find what pace you need to do the cardio at in order to stay in the aerobic zone (thus promoting the body's use of FAT for fuel) or better still walk/hike/do some other low-level activity that you actually LIKE to do. And, don't forget to LHT and Sprint following the PBF Triangle.
                      Re-focusing on the Primal Lifestyle in 2012!

                      Starting: 221.0lb, 29.5% BF (1/9/2012)
                      Latest: 208.9, 26.1% BF (3/19/2012)

                      http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread35679.html

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Fernaldo View Post
                        No, you need a caloric deficit to lose weight. Performing cardiovascular exercise can help create a caloric deficit. Use it as you see fit
                        Originally posted by Fernaldo View Post
                        Or you could do a HIIT workout twice a week and burn 2000 calories. "To lose weight" is a pretty vague statement. It all depends on current condition/state of the person. I use cardio (very minimal) to help with fat burning on leangains. I wouldn't recommend cardio for the sole purpose of weight loss, but it does have it's place when your diet is dialed in. For most people they feel better after doing it and feeling good goes a long way when trying to lose weight.
                        I'm confused. Your first post seems to be very much IN FAVOR of cardio. Then you lay a post on us that's pretty much all the same stuff that people who are arguing AGAINST cardio have been saying...

                        Which is it?
                        Re-focusing on the Primal Lifestyle in 2012!

                        Starting: 221.0lb, 29.5% BF (1/9/2012)
                        Latest: 208.9, 26.1% BF (3/19/2012)

                        http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread35679.html

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                        • #13
                          Sorry to go off topic, but I wanted to ask iniQuity about this:

                          Originally posted by iniQuity View Post
                          For instance. I'd like to sprint weekly right, but I don't do it, mostly because I have this stupid idea that if I don't sprint first thing in the morning then sprinting any other time is a waste of time. This is pretty wrong, sprinting at any hour is better than not doing it ever, but I was letting perfect be the enemy of good which ironically resulted in no activity at all. Another way to say this is, somebody who sprints in the afternoon is doing better than someone who never sprints, but the person sprinting first thing in the am is maybe doing a little better than the one that sprints in the afternoon... I hope that helps and isn't confusing.
                          Do you have a link about the benefits of sprinting in the am? I do my sprints in the weekend, normally in the afternoon, but if its better to do it in the am, I'll just get up 30 minutes earlier.
                          www.back-to-primal.blogspot.com or on Facebook here

                          My training journal if anyone is interested

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by tim_1522 View Post
                            I'm confused. Your first post seems to be very much IN FAVOR of cardio. Then you lay a post on us that's pretty much all the same stuff that people who are arguing AGAINST cardio have been saying...

                            Which is it?
                            Do you mind pointing out where, in my first post, I was IN FAVOR of cardio? My second post was in response to the 105 calories for running a mile. I was just stating you could create a larger deficit by doing something different. I am neither for or against it. It can be used to aid in weight loss. On these forums it's a very polarizing topic and any form is demonized as "chronic" cardio. I just don't see it this way. But, I revert back to my first post: No, it's not necessary.
                            "The problem with quoting someone on the Internet is, you never know if it's legit" - Abraham Lincoln

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Fernaldo View Post
                              Do you mind pointing out where, in my first post, I was IN FAVOR of cardio? My second post was in response to the 105 calories for running a mile. I was just stating you could create a larger deficit by doing something different. I am neither for or against it. It can be used to aid in weight loss. On these forums it's a very polarizing topic and any form is demonized as "chronic" cardio. I just don't see it this way. But, I revert back to my first post: No, it's not necessary.
                              Oh, I don't know...maybe the part where you said:

                              1)you need a caloric deficit to lose weight.
                              then
                              2)cardiovascular exercise can help create a caloric deficit
                              and concluded with
                              3)Use it as you see fit

                              If not outright advocating cardio, I think at best it will confuse the issue such that someone new to Primal looking for advice (such as the OP) might get the idea that cardio is a good idea.

                              Your first post said nothing about it not being necessary and (as I pointed out) implies that it's a good thing.
                              Re-focusing on the Primal Lifestyle in 2012!

                              Starting: 221.0lb, 29.5% BF (1/9/2012)
                              Latest: 208.9, 26.1% BF (3/19/2012)

                              http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread35679.html

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