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  • A question about veraity

    SOOOOO Lets jump right in shall we?

    My goals are to get stronger and have more functional muscle strength so that I can be prepared for any situation

    with that in mind I have a few questions about switiching up workouts

    1. Should you do it?

    2.is yes how should you do it, should you just increase the weight/difficultly (squat to pistol squat) or changeing the grip/hang position (pushup to wide or diamond pushups) or do you need to change it is some different way all together

  • #2
    If your talking about muscle confusion, that concept is crap. If that's your concern you want to read up on motor learning. If you're not increasing reps to muscle failure or increasing the weight or challenge to muscle failure, you are standing still.

    As far as being prepared for any situation, you're dreaming. Fight or Flight response will kick in when it matters. You may survive or you may meet your maker.
    Last edited by pyro13g; 07-29-2011, 07:51 PM.

    Comment


    • #3
      plus a big one - muscle confusion = crap

      We have SS/SL/NR people and HIT/BBS/HD people who love to argue and insult each other but the commonality is that simple strength is the basis of everything(except probably extreme endurance sports). Even on the xfit boards there is a very common idea that to be better at xfit running SS first would be a very good thing.

      I'm more and more of the opinion that it all boils down to push,pull,compound legs.
      mode of resistance means little
      exact protocol means little
      just f***ing push, pull and 'squat' something heavier regularly
      when(if) you stall 3 times move on to something clever

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by bcbcbc2 View Post
        plus a big one - muscle confusion = crap

        We have SS/SL/NR people and HIT/BBS/HD people who love to argue and insult each other but the commonality is that simple strength is the basis of everything(except probably extreme endurance sports). Even on the xfit boards there is a very common idea that to be better at xfit running SS first would be a very good thing.

        I'm more and more of the opinion that it all boils down to push,pull,compound legs.
        mode of resistance means little
        exact protocol means little
        just f***ing push, pull and 'squat' something heavier regularly
        when(if) you stall 3 times move on to something clever
        So if I wanted to I could stick with deadlifts and just up the weight without pleatuing? also what about changeing grip/hand position where does that fit in?

        Comment


        • #5
          a plateau means you progressed something long enough for it to get hard to make more progress. First thing is just to take a break, lower the weight and try to progress right through the old plateau weight. After you do that a couple times you may need to get complicated. Point is to actually get there before you worry about the fancy stuff.

          Changing grip on deads may be a poor example of what you're getting at. Other than going mixed when hanging onto the bar gets really difficult I don't see any point in ever changing grip.

          If variety is a goal in itself for you then I think you're better off creating a weekly program with variety than changing exercises weekly or monthly.
          ie
          m - bench
          w - dips
          f - db bench
          is probably much better than bench for 2 weeks change to dips etc etc

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by TraceurX View Post
            SOOOOO Lets jump right in shall we?

            My goals are to get stronger and have more functional muscle strength so that I can be prepared for any situation

            with that in mind I have a few questions about switiching up workouts

            1. Should you do it?

            2.is yes how should you do it, should you just increase the weight/difficultly (squat to pistol squat) or changeing the grip/hang position (pushup to wide or diamond pushups) or do you need to change it is some different way all together
            Everyone will have a different opinion on this, for good reason. The truth is that it depends on your goals. "Muscle Confusion" isn't crap as others have said but it is limited in application. Those that say "Muscle Confusion" is crap, just don't understand it's use. Changing the routine every workout or every week or every couple of weeks (Muscle Confusion) can be beneficial for general conditioning (GPP) and fat loss. However, if you are looking to gain strength in a specific movement or exercise then you would want to stick with that exercise for a period of time. For example, you can't get stronger at pull-ups by performing pulldowns on a machine. You can't better at deadlifts unless you train deadlifts. It's pretty simple.

            However, primal man obviously didn't perform the same physical movements every day of every week. So, it amazes me to see so many claim that we must stay with a specific routine for an extended period of time. Variety is not only beneficial from a physical standpoint (lower rates of overuse injuries) but also from a mental standpoint (more enjoyable and more likely to stick with regular exercise).

            Steve

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by pyro13g View Post
              If your talking about muscle confusion, that concept is crap. If that's your concern you want to read up on motor learning. If you're not increasing reps to muscle failure or increasing the weight or challenge to muscle failure, you are standing still.
              Training to failure is only one way of getting where you want to go. I previously trained with HIT for over 20 years and I have used it to train others. But to believe that it's the only way to accomplish the goal is misguided. There are a thousand times as many people not training to failure as those that do and they continue to get results.

              As far as being prepared for any situation, you're dreaming. Fight or Flight response will kick in when it matters. You may survive or you may meet your maker.
              I believe he was talking in the everyday sense, not necessarily about life and death altercations. However, even if he was there are ways to prepare the mind and body for life or death altercations as well. There are obviously no guarantees but those who have an understanding of the realities of life-or-death altercations and prepare for them accordingly will have a higher chance of successfully surviving them. It should also be emphasized that this preparation includes more than lifting some weights.

              Steve

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by bcbcbc2 View Post
                a plateau means you progressed something long enough for it to get hard to make more progress. First thing is just to take a break, lower the weight and try to progress right through the old plateau weight. After you do that a couple times you may need to get complicated. Point is to actually get there before you worry about the fancy stuff.

                Changing grip on deads may be a poor example of what you're getting at. Other than going mixed when hanging onto the bar gets really difficult I don't see any point in ever changing grip.

                If variety is a goal in itself for you then I think you're better off creating a weekly program with variety than changing exercises weekly or monthly.
                ie
                m - bench
                w - dips
                f - db bench
                is probably much better than bench for 2 weeks change to dips etc etc
                by hand grips I ment for pushups and pullups.

                @szorn
                In the primal fitness guide mark suggestions moveing on on the same exercises, slowly increaseing difficulty, is that the same idea? what type of plan would you suggest.

                Comment


                • #9
                  i think in order to be prepared for any situation, you need to put yourself in as many situations as you can. sure, find a strength program that works for you, but don't make that you're only workout. work on strength and endurance. lift barbells, do lots of bodyweight exercises, work with sandbags, pick up heavy things and throw them around, run, bike, swim, do plyometrics, climb things, and sprint your ass off.
                  http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread60178.html

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by primalrob View Post
                    i think in order to be prepared for any situation, you need to put yourself in as many situations as you can. sure, find a strength program that works for you, but don't make that you're only workout. work on strength and endurance. lift barbells, do lots of bodyweight exercises, work with sandbags, pick up heavy things and throw them around, run, bike, swim, do plyometrics, climb things, and sprint your ass off.
                    This sounds good, like something a knight or warrior or spartan would do....now to figure out a plan......

                    and just to confirm I shouldn't do things on a whim right? you should always plan ahead correct?
                    Last edited by TraceurX; 07-30-2011, 04:15 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by TraceurX View Post

                      @szorn
                      In the primal fitness guide mark suggestions moveing on on the same exercises, slowly increaseing difficulty, is that the same idea? what type of plan would you suggest.
                      The PBF program is a solid program to start on. Essentially you are working similar movement patterns as you progress but changing the exercises. So, it's actually the best of both worlds. You stay with an exercise long enough to develop strength and skill then move to the next variation of that exercise. This provides goals but prevents boredom and reduces overuse injuries from staying on any one exercise for too long.

                      The program you use should be based on what equipment you have available, how much time you have to train, what your current condition is, etc. What I would suggest is to choose a program that fits you based on those factors I just mentioned and then progressively strive to improve your performance, either through adding reps, additional weight, reduced rest time, etc. I would recommend a combination of bodyweight exercises and weights if you have them. To mix things up and keep the workouts interesting as well as "functional" you might also throw in sandbags, medicine balls, a weight sled, a sledgehammer & tire, maybe some rings (or suspension trainer), and maybe even a climbing rope. Personally I generally stay on one specific routine for about 4 weeks before changing it up. However, sometimes I go as long as 6-8 weeks on any one routine. I also often create an A workout and a B workout, then alternate them every workout. For example- my A workout may include a vertical pull exercise while my B workout includes a horizontal pull exercise. This way I am working the pull every workout, just from a different plane.

                      There is an interesting program available that includes the use of sandbags, kettlebells (or dumbbells), and bodyweight exercises if that is of interest to you and if you have the money to spend. Do a search for "Bags, Bells, and Bodyweight". It's a pretty good program designed to improve strength, conditioning, and athleticism. There are other good programs out there, it's just a matter of finding one that suits you and then doing it. I would suggest working the PBF bodyweight progressions since you already have the ebook. Then just add some of this other stuff into the mix as your conditioning improves.

                      Steve

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by pyro13g View Post
                        As far as being prepared for any situation, you're dreaming. Fight or Flight response will kick in when it matters. You may survive or you may meet your maker.
                        What BS. Being physical prepared means being able to run faster or fight harder than your attacker, or the guy standing next to you.
                        www.back-to-primal.blogspot.com or on Facebook here

                        My training journal if anyone is interested

                        Be strong to be useful

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by primalrob View Post
                          i think in order to be prepared for any situation, you need to put yourself in as many situations as you can. sure, find a strength program that works for you, but don't make that you're only workout. work on strength and endurance. lift barbells, do lots of bodyweight exercises, work with sandbags, pick up heavy things and throw them around, run, bike, swim, do plyometrics, climb things, and sprint your ass off.
                          Originally posted by szorn View Post
                          The PBF program is a solid program to start on. Essentially you are working similar movement patterns as you progress but changing the exercises. So, it's actually the best of both worlds. You stay with an exercise long enough to develop strength and skill then move to the next variation of that exercise. This provides goals but prevents boredom and reduces overuse injuries from staying on any one exercise for too long.

                          The program you use should be based on what equipment you have available, how much time you have to train, what your current condition is, etc. What I would suggest is to choose a program that fits you based on those factors I just mentioned and then progressively strive to improve your performance, either through adding reps, additional weight, reduced rest time, etc. I would recommend a combination of bodyweight exercises and weights if you have them. To mix things up and keep the workouts interesting as well as "functional" you might also throw in sandbags, medicine balls, a weight sled, a sledgehammer & tire, maybe some rings (or suspension trainer), and maybe even a climbing rope. Personally I generally stay on one specific routine for about 4 weeks before changing it up. However, sometimes I go as long as 6-8 weeks on any one routine. I also often create an A workout and a B workout, then alternate them every workout. For example- my A workout may include a vertical pull exercise while my B workout includes a horizontal pull exercise. This way I am working the pull every workout, just from a different plane.

                          There is an interesting program available that includes the use of sandbags, kettlebells (or dumbbells), and bodyweight exercises if that is of interest to you and if you have the money to spend. Do a search for "Bags, Bells, and Bodyweight". It's a pretty good program designed to improve strength, conditioning, and athleticism. There are other good programs out there, it's just a matter of finding one that suits you and then doing it. I would suggest working the PBF bodyweight progressions since you already have the ebook. Then just add some of this other stuff into the mix as your conditioning improves.

                          Steve
                          +1000000000000000000000 These help a LOT! Thank you!

                          -TraceurX

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