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  • Help with le Rippertoes

    Hey looking for some advice on starting strength, long background story coming up . After doing crossfit for 6 months and having my brother teach me the basics of the lifts I felt like I was really knowledgable and made my own program (lul). Was later inspired by the starting strength routine but still ended up doing something different aka "Hah! I laugh at your 30 years of training experience!". It ended up being something like..

    Day 1 back squat, bench press/behind the neck press (3x5), hang cleans (5x3) and day 2 zercher/front squats, deadlift (deadlifts also 3 work sets), chins/barbell rows.. Not a terrible routine, but still some abundant stuff in there, and after watching some body by science videos I also reduced my frequency to just two workouts a week. Recently stalled most of my lifts and realized I should just do starting strength properly to reach my short term goals of 1.5xbodyweight squat and deadlift and 1xbodyweight bench (im 85 kg atm).

    NOW THE DILEMNA: Done 2 training sessions one saturday and one monday on the original SS novice routine, and despite my saturday session being fairly light (squat -20kg than my wide stance max, powerclean from ground mostly getting the technique down -10kg of my hang clean, press -10 of my BTN max), I couldn't do the monday session properly; could only deadlift 120x2 reps when I'd done 115 for 1x5+2x3 the last session, and could only bench 70 for 3 reps when I'd done 70x5x3 previously.

    THE SOLUTION? Should I do a reset on all my lifts, and if yes how much should I take off the bar? Do I have to do GOMAD to sustain linear progression 3 times a week? Bikini season coming up and don't want to increase my squat 15kg if it requires me putting on 5kg of fat (would barely be worth it relatively). Would like to hear general experiences with the program aswell, and I think I'll put up some form check videos for my powerlifts the next time I have a m8 in the gym to film it.

  • #2
    How did you feel on Monday, were you still very sore? Perhaps an additional day of rest would have helped.

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    • #3
      Why don't you post this on the Starting Strength forum? Rippetoe himself will answer you.

      Gordo

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      • #4
        If Rip answers, I'd be interested in what he says. I would be reset by dropping the weight ~20%. Linear progression is powerful, and you want to wring every last bit out of it before going to more advanced programming.
        Lifting Journal

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        • #5
          I wasn't sore monday (today lol) but just seemed like my strength was down 10%.
          I haven't bought Starting Strength but just read the wiki and the forums. I believe I have a good understanding of how the lifts are performed aswell so I am not planning on buying the book, which is why I think it would be unfair to try and get rippertoe to answer my questions.

          Aanyways I think the sensible thing to do is a hard reset since I haven't "actually" been doing the program correctly, but I'm just reluctant to reduce all my lifts lol, and I'd rather do a 10% lift decrease. I think several of my lifts have stalled due to a sudden increase in training frequency (+ I never really moved into microloading because I can never find the 1.25 kg plates so I was doing 5kg increases from workout to workout, albeit only once a week) which definately sucks for anything but the squat and deadlift! On the other hand this is going to persist even after I reset...

          I was concerned about my squat because the lowbar position and looking down was causing my hips to raise faster than my shoulders and cause a slight goodmorning. According to this video he doesn't object to it: YouTube - Zach #320 x 5 x 5 Squats

          Another thing I just thought about (ah yes, love overthinking) Is just doing a 10% drop and starting on the advanced novice program now (without linear progression) since my current lifts are only 17, 12 and 8% off my current powerlifting goals.

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          • #6
            I've read most everything Rip's published. 20% was about the minimum I thought would be productive(men usually hate reducing their lifts)- he'd likely recommend more, probably much more. Remember that linear progression is intended to be easy at first. You are programming your muscles- he touches on it in SS, but covers it much more in Practical Programming. Also-using 5kg jumps is setting yourself up for sadness. Hope that helps.
            Lifting Journal

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            • #7
              http://startingstrength.com/articles...n_rippetoe.pdf

              If it were me, I'd buy the book and follow it. Your situation (not a newbie, but still with the possibility of novice gains using linear progression) is described in SS, and also in PP. Buy one, buy both, but read it. Reading the wiki and the forum is no substitute. Or, don't do SS, but don't say you are following SS.

              I'd personnally drop at least 20% or more and start from there. Sure, you'll have a few easy weeks, but then you'll bust through the plateau. I haven't hit the plateau yet, but I suspect one is in my future given how heavy the weights feel now. It's part of the program. Drop 20% and you'll make it up over time.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Abu Reena View Post
                http://startingstrength.com/articles...n_rippetoe.pdf

                If it were me, I'd buy the book and follow it. Your situation (not a newbie, but still with the possibility of novice gains using linear progression) is described in SS, and also in PP. Buy one, buy both, but read it. Reading the wiki and the forum is no substitute. Or, don't do SS, but don't say you are following SS.

                I'd personnally drop at least 20% or more and start from there. Sure, you'll have a few easy weeks, but then you'll bust through the plateau. I haven't hit the plateau yet, but I suspect one is in my future given how heavy the weights feel now. It's part of the program. Drop 20% and you'll make it up over time.
                +1

                Hadn't read that Rip article before- it should be stickied.
                Lifting Journal

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                • #9
                  If Rip were to answer this he'd probably say "You've only done 2 sessions and you're already asking questions about resetting. Just follow the programme for an appreciable length of time and then, if you're still having problems, ask again."
                  Sandbag Training For MMA & Combat Sports
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                  • #10
                    Coach: You are correct in how he'd answer, but he'd also drop a few f-bombs and some choice words about whether PandaDude is really a whiny 13 year old girl. It's part of Rip's charm!

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                    • #11
                      Youre right, but the thing is i just tried almost continuing with the poundages that I had worked with on my own random routine that I had stalled on rather than what was recommended about testing for when the bar speed slowed down and starting from there etc.

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                      • #12
                        Just do the damn program as it's written in the book. There is no other answer you'll get from Rippetoe or anyone over there. The first day of SS ought to be whatever weight slightly slows you down as you do it. If you add 5 of 10 lb to the bar and lift 3x week you'll be back at you PR in just a couple of weeks and ready for more. BTW - buy the book, and buy practical programming too, they are cheap and an amazing resource. It's really a pleasure just to read something that is so carefully and completely thought through, it's an intellectual treat (for me).
                        You DO have to eat a CRAPTON of food to maintain that progression - more than you will want to, more than is healthy in the long run. Nobody does that progress to 1.5 bw squat without putting on some fat. If that's a dealbreaker you should do a different program.
                        If you are new to the PB - please ignore ALL of this stuff, until you've read the book, or at least http://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-blueprint-101/ and this (personal fave): http://www.archevore.com/get-started/

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Abu Reena View Post
                          Coach: You are correct in how he'd answer, but he'd also drop a few f-bombs and some choice words about whether PandaDude is really a whiny 13 year old girl. It's part of Rip's charm!
                          Yeah - I was trying to be polite! He'd probably also mention something about PandaDude having a womb and asking whether he takes his panty-hoes off before he trains. Ah, the joys of heavy lifting, age and scotch....
                          Sandbag Training For MMA & Combat Sports
                          Sandbag Training Guide on Kindle
                          The Complete Guide To Sandbag Training
                          Brute Force Sandbags
                          www.facebook.com/sandbagfitness
                          http://fitedia.com/ - Health and Fitness eBooks, video, audio and workshops

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by tfarny View Post
                            Just do the damn program as it's written in the book. There is no other answer you'll get from Rippetoe or anyone over there. The first day of SS ought to be whatever weight slightly slows you down as you do it. If you add 5 of 10 lb to the bar and lift 3x week you'll be back at you PR in just a couple of weeks and ready for more. BTW - buy the book, and buy practical programming too, they are cheap and an amazing resource. It's really a pleasure just to read something that is so carefully and completely thought through, it's an intellectual treat (for me).
                            You DO have to eat a CRAPTON of food to maintain that progression - more than you will want to, more than is healthy in the long run. Nobody does that progress to 1.5 bw squat without putting on some fat. If that's a dealbreaker you should do a different program.
                            +1. I'm doing SS for now, but think that my bodyfat is such that I don't need to do any of the GOMAD stuff, per his book. I am eating extra, but it's not a huge amount extra. I'm also older (40) so I don't expect my linear progression will be as linear. I've been doing it for about 7 weeks, 2x a week (I need the extra recovery day!) and have gone from a 135 squat to 210 (3x5) at about 185 body weight. I've been trying to eat between 185 and 200 grams of protein on lifting and the first recovery day, and as close to 180 grams of protein on the other recovery days, but I'm not as careful.

                            My goals are 270 squat (roughly 1.5 BW) and 300 lbs for the dead. I like the LP because you don't have to think. If you made your lifts the prior session, just go up 5 lbs. Don't have to think "how do I feel, are my panties in a wad . . ." (channeling my inner-Rip.)

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                            • #15
                              Yeah, the "eat more" part is something you have to feel out for yourself as you go - if you are not recovering, eat / sleep more. Sleeping right was a major problem for me, also getting pneumonia in the middle of things. When I tackle it again it'll be twice a week and I'll put the squats on the intermediate plan - volume day then PR day.
                              If you are new to the PB - please ignore ALL of this stuff, until you've read the book, or at least http://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-blueprint-101/ and this (personal fave): http://www.archevore.com/get-started/

                              Comment

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