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New here, and...I don't want to lose weight!

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  • #16
    1



    I should have said: there is no way to gain WEIGHT without gaining some as fat. Because that is what I meant.


    You can definitely fine-tune your body comp to a large extent with diet and exercise as I have seen first hand in people on this board, and in myself (5 months primal=sixpack with no exercise).


    However I've read studies about deliberate weight gain, and every person monitered put on some of the weight as muscle, some as fat, whether it was internal or external. But like I said above, none of them were eating primal, and until we study people who do we don't know what's possible, for sure.

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    • #17
      1



      @Allbeef Patty -


      You're right, I need to focus on nutritionally dense foods if I hope to increase my daily caloric intake. I'm not too keen on fruit salad, but perhaps a whole-milk plain yogurt with coconut milk, blueberries, nuts, and honey would do the trick. Sounds delicious at any rate.


      @yodiewan -


      Thanks for the reply, and the link to Mark's blog entry on this topic. I just read it, and it gave me some good ideas.


      @chima_p -


      My doctor specifically mentioned that I could use a little more body fat. Perhaps he just said that because he knew it would be easier to put on fat than muscle? Not sure.


      @BlazeKING -


      I appreciate your post. The only thing I would say in response is that I'm not really interested in putting on a "lot" of muscle mass, nor do I care that much about doing it quickly. Your advice sounds like it's tailored to someone who wants to get into strength-training hardcore, and get results as quickly as possible. I'm not sure if I'm quite there yet, but I do appreciate your thoughts.


      @animalcule -


      I'm glad you've come to accept that you're destined to stay skinny. For the most part I've made peace with that as well. I'm willing to give it an honest shot to see if I can gain a modest amount of muscle (and fat if need be), but like you, I think if I'm healthy that's what matters most.


      @arthurb999 -


      You don't say!


      @misathemeb -


      Nut butter, got it. My wife just brought home a jar of cashew butter -- will that do the trick?


      @stabby -


      I hear 'ya on the quality vs quantity of food issue. I'm not ready to dive into massive calorie consumption just yet, I don't think...but it's encouraging to hear that someone who did that was able to gain some muscle fairly quickly. I must admit, 5 pounds in 2 weeks sounds too good to be true. I'm going to have to assume that a good portion of that increase was due to fat and water. That makes it a lot more believable.


      @everyone -


      My emphasis is on eating well and slowly gaining muscle mass. I'm not in a big hurry, and to me personally, I don't feel it's worth it to gorge on food to the point of discomfort, and lift very heavy things in an attempt to gain as much as I can as fast as I can. I'm not knocking anyone else who choses to do that, but I don't think that's for me. I do recognize that I will have to get more calories (esp protein) and do progressively more strength training in order to put on muscle though.

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      • #18
        1



        Does anybody beside me wonder if TBL's doctor is nuts? Confusing correlates with causality? Just because the average 6' guy is so many pounds doesn't mean you should be. Maybe your the outlier who is 'normal for you' at a lower weight.


        Geesh. Don't risk some metabolic syndrome by driving up insulin levels so you can add body fat. That is the wrong approach.


        I think 8% BF is fine. I'd love 8% BF!!!! Some peeps are just meant by god to be skinny. You are graced.


        The main thing I think - are your blood tests are OK? (See Mark's list of recommended blood tests) Endocrine system working OK?


        Now - adding some muscle to protect yourself from age related sarcopenia - I think that is 'da bomb'


        IMHO: stay primal, and get a 2nd opinion, and don't worry so much about BF calipers and BMI. My $0.02.


        best

        -jim-

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        • #19
          1



          Tarlach, my roommate has no trouble building muscle and losing fat either...


          ..But he is 290 pounds and just got started into strength training 2 months ago. He has the energy already to build muscle and doesn't really need to eat a surplus. Many untrained individuals regardless of how much they are eating will gain some muscle, but it will slow down fast unless they start eating bigger or they are already big%fat.


          At over 6' and around 150 pounds, the gains will slow down fast and you won't get much bigger or stronger without eating enough to recover from workouts and gain weight.


          If you are a skinny guy for your height and you want to build a decent structure with muscle and strength, you really do need to gain weight and by gaining weight you will gain fat as well. You won't get "fat" if you are training right.


          OP, I can see the point of taking your time on things, but wouldn't it be better to get to a strength and size point in 5 months doing the right things instead of taking 5 years to get to the same point? Time is valuable. Strength is valuable.

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          • #20
            1



            If I want to gain significant amounts of weight in a short time I have to eat in excess of 3500 calories per day (as a 100-lb woman with a 23" waist, this requires literally stuffing myself). Overeating causes physical discomfort, digestive disturbances, and getting overheated and sweaty as my body tries to literally 'burn off' excess calories. I've done this, I've gained weight, and I've lost it again when I stopped going to those lengths. How can this be more healthy for my body than trying to achieve a slight caloric excess each day and hopefully putting on a little weight each year as I age?


            And stregnth is valuable, but bulk isn't the only factor in strength. I can outperform women who outweigh me by 30-80 lbs (admittedly most of them aren't in great shape; but then, neither am I, I've been practically sedentary for months now).


            Anyway I think hardgainers are a different breed than the majority on this board, and having to go to such extreme lengths to achieve the same results that come with a reasonable diet and exercise plan to people with different metabolisms shouldn't be our goal, if we are truly focusing on our health.

            Comment


            • #21
              1



              There's absolutely nothing wrong with having 10% body fat. That's actually about ideal for a man. My husband just tested at 10% and people always comment on him (and me) being skinny, but that's just because the majority of people are overweight nowadays. Compare yourself to someone living a tribal hunter-gatherer lifestyle and you probably look just fine. With your height and weight you could probably pass for a Masai!


              As for your doctor, the study that was been done correlating low body fat/BMI with higher rates of death included peoplein the analysis with diseases that can cause wasting, which skews the results. Actually, when patients were followed over long periods of time, it was found that weight change (from a higher to a lower BMI) is the best predictor for increased mortality.

              Comment


              • #22
                1

                [quote]

                by gaining weight you will gain fat as well
                </blockquote>


                As I said, this is not true.


                Eating a massive amount of calories while strength training does not have to make you store fat (even with already low body fat).


                I&#39;m over 6&#39; and less than 180lb. I eat a stupid amount of calories and I&#39;m building muscle whilst losing fat.


                It&#39;s more about what you eat and when.

                The "Seven Deadly Sins"

                Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
                Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
                Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

                Comment


                • #23
                  1



                  I don&#39;t think I gained any fat and my muscles are bigger. But I will admit that there is a chance the 5 pounds in 2 weeks was partly water fluctuation. That does seem to be too good to be true. Point is, the muscles are bigger and stronger and noticeably so.

                  Stabbing conventional wisdom in its face.

                  Anyone who wants to talk nutrition should PM me!

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    1



                    Tarlach, any cites?

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      1

                      [quote]

                      Tarlach, any cites?
                      </blockquote>


                      This is mostly just personal experience (and what I have heard from others here). But there&#39;s no better proof than to see it work on yourself.


                      Here&#39;s some info I read today:
                      [quote]

                      For 75% of the population, I strongly believe that if you want to gain lean body mass while losing fat, the low-carb approach will do it better than anything
                      </blockquote>
                      [quote]

                      Hypertrophy and strength aren&#39;t hindered when carbohydrate intake is limited. That&#39;s a common thought, but is just not true, nor holds any substantial evidence. Hypertrophy and strength gains are staled when your energy intake is too low. You can eat a LCD and still excel in the weightroom just as long as you&#39;re eating enough food. </blockquote>


                      Part 2 is here

                      The "Seven Deadly Sins"

                      Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
                      Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
                      Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        1



                        Tarlach your wife eats very similarly to you, correct? Does she also train, and if so, has she seen the same sort of results you have? I&#39;m wondering what differences there are between men and women.


                        I have gained weight since going high-calorie primal. I do eat tubers and lots of dairy, and I haven&#39;t been working out whatsoever. Even so I&#39;ve gained visible muscle growth and definition on my body parts that don&#39;t carry any fat (belly, arms, back, lower legs). But my butt, thighs and boobs are putting on more padding, enough that it&#39;s obscuring formerly defined muscles (pectoral region, thigh muscles). My hormones seem to be balancing on this diet (from acne to menstrual cycle to a vast decrease in both the rate of body hair growth and the fineness of the hairs), and I think it&#39;s natural that this would cause increases in feminine body markers (more fat distributed in certain ways being the big thing that sets us apart from men).

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                        • #27
                          1



                          My wife eats more often than I do and more carbs. She has to make meals for the kids and end up eating when they do.


                          We do our training together. She has lots a lot of body fat over the years and she&#39;s trying to put some muscle back on now.

                          It&#39;s hard to tell how she is going, because she is still losing fat, but her arms are looking much more defined now. She&#39;s also doing well with improving strength.

                          The "Seven Deadly Sins"

                          Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
                          Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
                          Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            me either...

                            I decided to go primal (cold turkey) last month. I'm 5-10 and now weigh 129. Lost 6 pounds last month while i was on the diet. I'm fairly active... rock climbing, mountain biking, etc... but not much weightlifting at all. I don't want to lose the weight... I was eating a lot... way more than normal. I was never hungry, but ate anyway. I'll try some more heavy lifting and adding some more calories. Butter on EVERYTHING! haha... thanks for all the good input!

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              I understand your pain but from a different aspect. When i started this I weighed 195 lbs and I looked pretty healthy. I had always carried a little fat on me which made me look a little bigger than I actually was. When I started eating Primally I lost about 20 lbs over a 2 month period while working out on a more consistent basis. I started to get worried I was getting to skinny but I changed my mentality when I saw how much healthier I was/felt. With this lifestyle most if not all people will lose weight b/c you change your eating habits. You're not eating as many fillers and the food you do eat is what we evolved on so it will make your body run more efficiently. I workout all the time. I rock climb, climb ropes, trees, body weight exercises and sprints. I don't lift too many heavy things b/c of my back but I am started too. This will only help accelerate the process for me as I know it would for you as well.

                              I was glad to lose the weight b/c I am now going to challenge Mark with a few pics of my own in the next few months. Of course I am also 25 yrs younger than he is but if anyone has proven this will work at nearly any age it would be him. Since I started to think of myself too small I added more high quality fat and almost doubled my protein intake. I've been able to add about 6 lbs of lean muscle and hope to add 5-10 lbs more in the next 3-4 months. You just to to tweak what you eat, the amount and how you exercise. It's not hard to do if you can come up with a good plan and attack it form all angles. I don't count all the fat grams, protein like I should but in your case I would suggest keeping a journal with everything you're eating so you can better track. You'll know if I shoudl add more of this or less of that. I've started ot do this somewhat but still trying to work out a system that suits me.
                              Today is a new day. You will get out of it just what you put into it. If you have made mistakes, there is always another chance for you. And supposing you have tried and failed again and again, you may have a fresh start any moment you choose, for this thing we call 'Failure' is not the falling down, but the staying down.

                              Mary Pickford

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                              • #30
                                You might also look into Scrawny to Brawny. It's specifically targeted at hardgainers.
                                http://www.theprimalprepper.com - preparing for life's worst while living for the best

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